Cubit Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 So it is. I wonder if surgeons, doctors, fireman etc down tools when they have worked their hours and are doing something really important? But that's the difference isn't it. They are doing something important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxo Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 So are we. Earning money for our families. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew.brough Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 But that's the difference isn't it. They are doing something important I do look at all the late night calls that engineers get and wonder how many are really so important that they need dealing with straight away. On the one occasion we had a server die that weakened our monitoring servers to 2. I didn't wake some poor sod up at 3 in the morning, I waited until 10 their time and got it resolved then. Seems in our game people wake us up for the most rediculous, non urgent things. www.securitywarehouse.co.uk/catalog/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 Id say they have been a couple of valid points in here 1. Driving tired is dangerous. We have commercial driving hours etc on trucks but not on vans etc. No sane employer would demand anyone worked tired due to the risks on site as well as travelling. The risk should be assesed by the employee in every action that is taken. 2. This 8 hour thing is sensible but in not sure i go with the 6 oclock call argument. Assuming there has been 8 hours rest before 6? I would not expect an engineer that had been out all night to be in at 8:30. as noted though all the employer can control is work. If the employee clocks off at 5, parties till 5 am, then claims tiredness issues id say that was thier issue. Go sick by all means but don't use h&s rules. Same with new parents. seems its ok if its not work related and the tiredness is not an issue. id like to be able to employ people without contantly worrying that I'm supposed to have done something to prevent something. When that something happens then its not xyz that actually did it, somehow its my fault. Its a shared responsibility Imo. I get that there are some rough employers out there but there are also some good ones. We seem to spend time looking for who to blame, make pay etc and on the flio side cover our arses. as this system continues we will end up with 1 man bands or small family cos who dare not employ anyone and huge firms that can manage all this, with very little in the middle. all imvho securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxo Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 I was going to reply but I might have to call in late if I do. OOPS I did Oi boss. Gonna be late Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew.brough Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 James has a valid point. There are many other issues that effect staffs sleep such as going out, kids etc. I also share James view that if you get it o the point of so many rules it will only be the likes of adt who are hiring.we need less regulation where staff are concerned if people are to be encouraged to hire people again. www.securitywarehouse.co.uk/catalog/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubit Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 The one for supervisors upwards to consider is Corporate Manslaughter. James has a valid point. There are many other issues that effect staffs sleep such as going out, kids etc. I also share James view that if you get it o the point of so many rules it will only be the likes of adt who are hiring.we need less regulation where staff are concerned if people are to be encouraged to hire people again. There is adequate regulation - just that maanagers don't know how tp apply it correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew.brough Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 Tbh I'm not sure of the rules. Since our well known about slate of tribunals that were settled not really been in the mood for giving anyone jobs. The gang of contractors we have also think very different to that of employees. I know in a couple of industries my pals are in freelancing / self employment is the norm now. Maybe employers will get that fed up of having their pants taken down we will all go the same way in time. www.securitywarehouse.co.uk/catalog/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubit Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 Tbh I'm not sure of the rules. Since our well known about slate of tribunals that were settled not really been in the mood for giving anyone jobs. The gang of contractors we have also think very different to that of employees. I know in a couple of industries my pals are in freelancing / self employment is the norm now. Maybe employers will get that fed up of having their pants taken down we will all go the same way in time. I've not seen you post anything complimentary about employees (in general), do you not think your previous staffing problems you refer to may have been due to issues entirely within your control? As for companies only using self employed - what was it you praised webway for only this morning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted June 2, 2013 Share Posted June 2, 2013 I think it has to be fair. There are some awful employers out there. There does need to be regulation. But as highlighted on here it is not a level playing field. Some get xy some get z etc etc. securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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