RuralRon Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 I'm looking for a little guidance on a system for a DIY install. I'm competant in domestic electrics, very experienced in IT and also had many years of IP comms and ethernet structured cabling experience. So I think I can manage an alarm install (with a bit of reasearch and advice!) I live in a rural location. In a 3.5 acre secluded plot with a couple of reasonably close neighbours. Am told there's zero history of break in around here. My property is impossible to see from any roads and down a tiny track. However, there is a first time for everything and it is isolated and would be vulnerable if someone knew we were out and wanted to have a go. Time for an alarm, I think. I like doing stuff myself. I like understanding how stuff works and enjoy it. It also means I can probably spend more on the hardware than if I went the pro install route. I'm a bit overwhelmed by the choice of systems, I have read the thread outliming the main trusted brands, but struggling to fix on one. Here are my requirements: 1. quality and reliable - having worked in technology for many years, I believe it is worth buying good kit rather than fighting with rubbish that never quite works as expected all just to save a few quid. 2. duress/panic activation setting - I would like for my wife to feel that if she were forced to disarm, it would notify someone or she could set it off if she thought someone was on site uninvited. 3. I need 4 PIRs internally, plus a few shock/vibration sensors for doors. Perhaps 3 internal zones. Flexibility to create different activation profiles - night time, and so on. 4. I need a seperate double garage on a zone (PIR and vibration sensor) - will sound a notifcation in the house when I am home or trigger external sounder and remote notification when I am away 5. Remote comms - I need to be informed if the alarm is activated by SMS and call to a series of numbers. I live in a bungalow and the phone line is low (very vulnerable) - any theif with a brain would cut it, I need GPRS/GSM backup so need some sort of dial out function which can use PSTN and GSM/GPRS. Would like to use a PAYG SIM. 6. I would like a open/close sensor on the main gate which is the only realistic path into the property (sounds internal notification to let me know someone has entered, possibly activates hidden video camera as a later upgrade) 7. External sensors for night time – internal notification/floodlight activation perhaps (though we have foxes and rabbits galore so would be wary of any risk of false postive) 8. Two external sounders – one hidden. Again, bungalow so external sounders would be vulnerable. Would like one on full view and a second hidden outside to suprise them if triggered. battery back up - power where I am is via overhead. You'd be brave to cut it, but it is something someone could do if they knew what they were doing. Would like the panel, comms and sounders to run without mains on battery. 9. police response - I dont want pro monitoring to start and dont think a police response would be quick enough anyway as I assume most thieves will want to turn a place over in short order and get out. But I do hold firearms (legally, I might add) and I wonder if I get an SMS/call from my system and then dial 999, would my informing that firearms are stored force a police response where normally they'd not bother without other indications of an intruder? 10. nearly forgot - needs to be easy to set. Perhaps the keypad by the door and the panel in the loft area. Some sort of fob management would help - need this to be wife friendly as we have three kids and she wont want to be fiddling about setting/disarming it, some of sort of one click fob would be good. sorry for the long post. I've looked at various sytems just struggling to be clear on which tick all my boxes. thanks for any guidance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuralRon Posted January 30, 2013 Author Share Posted January 30, 2013 sorry, also would like to go with a wired system. I like wires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoupDragon Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 I'm not an alarm engineer (maybe one day ) but the accenta G4 is a great wired DIY panel. It's got 8 zones, dedicated alarm outputs (intruder/pa ect) and has a duress code. You should look at the Menvier GSM Speech and Text Dialler for coms. Though If you're worried about someone cutting the phone lines then you should be worried about mobile signal jammers. From what I understand reading these forums, you won't get a police response from an alarm unless you have a URN and that's not going to happen with a DIY job. To be honest if you feel the need to signal a hold up then you should look at getting a pro in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuralRon Posted January 30, 2013 Author Share Posted January 30, 2013 Dont get me wrong - I'm not living in some high value target which needs an all singing all dancing set up. It's just a shabby rural bungalow - the target appeal is the isolation, I think. But just want to find a system which gives me the most protection for the money. Seems I can add the remote dialing for what would be a very reasonable cost spread over the life of system. I understand that it's not failsafe (the point on jamming). But I dont have cash for a fully monitored package where they can even alert if the control panel stops responding. But if I can install a decent system, and add a fair chance of being alerted remotely then seems worthwhile. I have a couple of farming neighbours who would respond on site for me (I offer them the same service). I will call the crime prevention officer and enquire about response to property with registered firearms stored - my gut feel is this would tip in favour of a priority response but I may be wrong. The duress code would be some additional peace of mind for the Mrs when I'm away, I realise again these things arent fail proof. I'm trying to add some additional measures to a DIY system at a cost point, and accept that limitations over a pro/fully managed installation. if things look too complicated, fiddly or expensive then I'll draw a line. At the end of the day, a decent but basic unmonitored alarm would be a big improvement over nothing. I will take a look at the panel and dialer you suggested ,thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 I'm looking for a little guidance on a system for a DIY install. I'm competant in domestic electrics, very experienced in IT and also had many years of IP comms and ethernet structured cabling experience. So I think I can manage an alarm install (with a bit of reasearch and advice!) I live in a rural location. In a 3.5 acre secluded plot with a couple of reasonably close neighbours. Am told there's zero history of break in around here. My property is impossible to see from any roads and down a tiny track. However, there is a first time for everything and it is isolated and would be vulnerable if someone knew we were out and wanted to have a go. Time for an alarm, I think. I like doing stuff myself. I like understanding how stuff works and enjoy it. It also means I can probably spend more on the hardware than if I went the pro install route. I'm a bit overwhelmed by the choice of systems, I have read the thread outliming the main trusted brands, but struggling to fix on one. Here are my requirements: 1. quality and reliable - having worked in technology for many years, I believe it is worth buying good kit rather than fighting with rubbish that never quite works as expected all just to save a few quid. 2. duress/panic activation setting - I would like for my wife to feel that if she were forced to disarm, it would notify someone or she could set it off if she thought someone was on site uninvited. 3. I need 4 PIRs internally, plus a few shock/vibration sensors for doors. Perhaps 3 internal zones. Flexibility to create different activation profiles - night time, and so on. 4. I need a seperate double garage on a zone (PIR and vibration sensor) - will sound a notifcation in the house when I am home or trigger external sounder and remote notification when I am away 5. Remote comms - I need to be informed if the alarm is activated by SMS and call to a series of numbers. I live in a bungalow and the phone line is low (very vulnerable) - any theif with a brain would cut it, I need GPRS/GSM backup so need some sort of dial out function which can use PSTN and GSM/GPRS. Would like to use a PAYG SIM. 6. I would like a open/close sensor on the main gate which is the only realistic path into the property (sounds internal notification to let me know someone has entered, possibly activates hidden video camera as a later upgrade) 7. External sensors for night time – internal notification/floodlight activation perhaps (though we have foxes and rabbits galore so would be wary of any risk of false postive) 8. Two external sounders – one hidden. Again, bungalow so external sounders would be vulnerable. Would like one on full view and a second hidden outside to suprise them if triggered. battery back up - power where I am is via overhead. You'd be brave to cut it, but it is something someone could do if they knew what they were doing. Would like the panel, comms and sounders to run without mains on battery. 9. police response - I dont want pro monitoring to start and dont think a police response would be quick enough anyway as I assume most thieves will want to turn a place over in short order and get out. But I do hold firearms (legally, I might add) and I wonder if I get an SMS/call from my system and then dial 999, would my informing that firearms are stored force a police response where normally they'd not bother without other indications of an intruder? 10. nearly forgot - needs to be easy to set. Perhaps the keypad by the door and the panel in the loft area. Some sort of fob management would help - need this to be wife friendly as we have three kids and she wont want to be fiddling about setting/disarming it, some of sort of one click fob would be good. sorry for the long post. I've looked at various sytems just struggling to be clear on which tick all my boxes. thanks for any guidance! i think some police forces may insist on a professionally installed alarm, ie by an approved company, with response for rifles on the premises but not shotguns. if i'm right then, i assume you only have shotguns otherwise you'd already have an alarm. don't scrimp on the monitoring - if the GSM dialler is jammed then how are you going to know about it? what you want is not going to be cheap and I feel you'd be better off getting someone in, if you can't afford to pay out all at once for all of it then get it done in stages perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lwillis Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 As above, Id recommend getting somebody in to quote for it, especially with firearms on the premises. I'm surprised your insurers haven't insisted on a monitored alarm system. Not quite DIY but a Scantronic with the prox keypad would be easier than a galaxy ( our preferred panel of choice) Have seen a "master blaster" used on some rural locations to scare anybody off as they are hellish loud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxo Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 How are you registered to hold firearms and the Police do not know? What criteria did they give for storage and fitting of gun cabinates to gain your certificate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuralRon Posted January 31, 2013 Author Share Posted January 31, 2013 I think asking the point about the firearms and police response was, in hindsight, a poor question to raise here. I will discuss with my local firearms officer who will know clearly whether registered firearms will alter the response to a 999 for an alarm activation. I suspect it will, but I'm interested to find out. to clear up some points - ofcourse they "know" they are registered, that's rather inherent in the act of acquiring a certficate! Will this appear on the 999 operator's screen when I call? I don't know. Again, I will find out. there is no legal requirement for a fully monitored alarm for FAC or SC. The home office publish this guidance which will be applied by a firearms officer when assessing an application.http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/publications/police/firearms/security_leaflet.pdf?view=Binary An alarm will help, no doubt, and no doubt forces and individual officers will apply the guidance differently, but I've never heard of anyone I know being oliged to fit an alarm, which is in line with the guidance for level 1 situations. The emphasis is primarily the cabinet (BS7558) and building physical security. Alarms only come into things if you live in a high crime area or have a history of break in. And then the guidance stops short of fully monitored. Ofcourse holders will often have alarms - it's obviously a good idea, but just want to clear up the myth that SC and FAC holders are required to have alarms, now what I was really after was some suggestions on a system that would work well, allow me to add more stuff over time, and be reasonably straight forward to install for someone with lots of technical knowledge but no direct experience of alarms. I have had a couple of suggestions which I will consider. Having thought over night, I will also get a few pro quotes - I think then I can decide what level of protection I want and what I'm prepared to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 I'm looking for a little guidance on a system for a DIY install. I'm competant in domestic electrics, very experienced in IT and also had many years of IP comms and ethernet structured cabling experience. So I think I can manage an alarm install (with a bit of reasearch and advice!) I live in a rural location. In a 3.5 acre secluded plot with a couple of reasonably close neighbours. Am told there's zero history of break in around here. My property is impossible to see from any roads and down a tiny track. However, there is a first time for everything and it is isolated and would be vulnerable if someone knew we were out and wanted to have a go. Time for an alarm, I think. I like doing stuff myself. I like understanding how stuff works and enjoy it. It also means I can probably spend more on the hardware than if I went the pro install route. I'm a bit overwhelmed by the choice of systems, I have read the thread outliming the main trusted brands, but struggling to fix on one. Here are my requirements: 1. quality and reliable - having worked in technology for many years, I believe it is worth buying good kit rather than fighting with rubbish that never quite works as expected all just to save a few quid. Id agree 2. duress/panic activation setting - I would like for my wife to feel that if she were forced to disarm, it would notify someone or she could set it off if she thought someone was on site uninvited. Id urge caution here. If this is a risk and a panic button is not suitable, your risk is high and diy is not advised 3. I need 4 PIRs internally, plus a few shock/vibration sensors for doors. Perhaps 3 internal zones. Flexibility to create different activation profiles - night time, and so on. Most decent panels will allow this. Look at texecom, galaxy, hkc 4. I need a seperate double garage on a zone (PIR and vibration sensor) - will sound a notifcation in the house when I am home or trigger external sounder and remote notification when I am away From your other comment I guess your wiring if so it just another detector. ensure the environment is suitable for a pir though 5. Remote comms - I need to be informed if the alarm is activated by SMS and call to a series of numbers. I live in a bungalow and the phone line is low (very vulnerable) - any theif with a brain would cut it, I need GPRS/GSM backup so need some sort of dial out function which can use PSTN and GSM/GPRS. Would like to use a PAYG SIM. you can use a pay g sim but I wouldn't recommend it 6. I would like a open/close sensor on the main gate which is the only realistic path into the property (sounds internal notification to let me know someone has entered, possibly activates hidden video camera as a later upgrade) no issue as long as you use a panel with programmable outputs that can link to circuits 7. External sensors for night time – internal notification/floodlight activation perhaps (though we have foxes and rabbits galore so would be wary of any risk of false postive) We use the hkc panel which will support upto 8 areas of lighting 8. Two external sounders – one hidden. Again, bungalow so external sounders would be vulnerable. Would like one on full view and a second hidden outside to suprise them if triggered. Just watch your current consumption battery back up - power where I am is via overhead. You'd be brave to cut it, but it is something someone could do if they knew what they were doing. Would like the panel, comms and sounders to run without mains on battery. Again even the cheapest of decent stuff will do this 9. police response - I dont want pro monitoring to start and dont think a police response would be quick enough anyway as I assume most thieves will want to turn a place over in short order and get out. But I do hold firearms (legally, I might add) and I wonder if I get an SMS/call from my system and then dial 999, would my informing that firearms are stored force a police response where normally they'd not bother without other indications of an intruder? I doubt it, why would the police have a method of pro using a response if anyone could do it this way. 10. nearly forgot - needs to be easy to set. Perhaps the keypad by the door and the panel in the loft area. Some sort of fob management would help - need this to be wife friendly as we have three kids and she wont want to be fiddling about setting/disarming it, some of sort of one click fob would be good. Panel that supports proximity fobs. sorry for the long post. I've looked at various sytems just struggling to be clear on which tick all my boxes. thanks for any guidance! securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronnie Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 I think asking the point about the firearms and police response was, in hindsight, a poor question to raise here. I will discuss with my local firearms officer who will know clearly whether registered firearms will alter the response to a 999 for an alarm activation. I suspect it will, but I'm interested to find out. to clear up some points - ofcourse they "know" they are registered, that's rather inherent in the act of acquiring a certficate! Will this appear on the 999 operator's screen when I call? I don't know. Again, I will find out. there is no legal requirement for a fully monitored alarm for FAC or SC. The home office publish this guidance which will be applied by a firearms officer when assessing an application.http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/publications/police/firearms/security_leaflet.pdf?view=Binary An alarm will help, no doubt, and no doubt forces and individual officers will apply the guidance differently, but I've never heard of anyone I know being oliged to fit an alarm, which is in line with the guidance for level 1 situations. The emphasis is primarily the cabinet (BS7558) and building physical security. Alarms only come into things if you live in a high crime area or have a history of break in. And then the guidance stops short of fully monitored. Ofcourse holders will often have alarms - it's obviously a good idea, but just want to clear up the myth that SC and FAC holders are required to have alarms, now what I was really after was some suggestions on a system that would work well, allow me to add more stuff over time, and be reasonably straight forward to install for someone with lots of technical knowledge but no direct experience of alarms. I have had a couple of suggestions which I will consider. Having thought over night, I will also get a few pro quotes - I think then I can decide what level of protection I want and what I'm prepared to pay. every day is a school day. thanks for clearing this up and the attached leaflet. i would still recommend you get a company in though. what area are you in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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