Brian c Posted September 24, 2004 Share Posted September 24, 2004 Cheeky b#ggers I like to think about what I type yer know 24772[/snapback] (you can just edit it later to suit your argument) If you don't know......ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Service Engineer Posted September 24, 2004 Share Posted September 24, 2004 thats why there called preventative maintenance No one can predict the future Pete, and neither can preventative maintenance. How do you know your not changing a perfectly good device, that might work perfectly ok for the next 10 years. ........................................................ Dave Partridge (Romec Service Engineer) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian c Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 thats why there called preventative maintenance No one can predict the future Pete, and neither can preventative maintenance. How do you know your not changing a perfectly good device, that might work perfectly ok for the next 10 years. 24779[/snapback] You don't know, I agree. but electrical components deteriorate/degrade over time. A small current increase to a detector can affect the control panel and the cabling. I admit it would be very little, but over ten or twenty years as you suggest, the whole install will degrade in affectiveness and efficiency. In a lot of cases, resulting in more cost to the customer due to call outs and,eventually, a new system, rather than straight forward upgrade after 10 years or so If you don't know......ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian c Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 At the end of the day, it gets dark only kiddin, you like that one?use it if you want at the end of the day it's down to the cutomer. Make them aware of new technology and the problems that COULD arise from their old equipment and let them make their own mind up If you don't know......ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deltaseven Posted September 25, 2004 Author Share Posted September 25, 2004 My opinion - It always has to be the customer's decision on whether to keep up to date or not. The maintenance is their annual 'health check' - and they expect that their system will be trouble-free for another year. (Not always the case, I know....) The customer is not likely to realise that their passives are getting on a bit, and will be more prone to FA than a nice new shiny set, and if the option of an upgrade is not given to them, they are likely to ask why the 'fault' was not picked up at the maintenance (even though there was no fault at the maintenance). In short - recommend an upgrade on any antique equipment - give the customer all the info they require, and let them decide. D7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breff Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 Ive got one question for you boys, how many of you have tft monitors? What was wrong with the old green or orange screen monochrome huge beasts of 20 years ago. They were ****, thats what was wrong with them. Eng, I suppose you havent got a widescreen TV and home cinema? The opinions I express are mine and are usually correct! (Except when I'm wrong)(which I'm not) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morph Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 We have flush toilets inside our house Why because it saves getting cold and technology has moved on But seriously as a professional installer, you have to consider at what point you have to say to the customer that there system is no longer effective. If you go there every year to service the system and produce a maintenance sheet to say that the system is working correctly and that it will operate in the event of a breakin, then you as the installer must consider the risk. Yes, the system may have been put in 10/15 years ago and was ideal for the situation at that time, but components age, plastic changes its structure, people smoke, paint etc, etc. You also have to consider that just as technology has changed so has the ways of defeating them. When selling, installing, maintaining a security system you have to consider "Risk" this isn't just a factor that affects the initial installation, its a whole of life factor. As a professional installer you have to take this risk into account and as such you can only reccomend that the system is no longer compliant or suitable for the associated "Risk" if you simply attend every year, service the system, collect the money and issue a service docket then you are essentially accepting that the system is suitable for the risk. Yes initially you can log it on the service docket that things need to be improved but how long do you continue to do that for, there is also the point of what the insurance company would say if the property was broken into, who is liable? the Customer for not listening or you for not acting? Colin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian c Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 well said my mate If you don't know......ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Service Engineer Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 Yes, the system may have been put in 10/15 years ago and was ideal for the situation at that time, but components age, plastic changes its structure, people smoke, paint etc, etc. You also have to consider that just as technology has changed so has the ways of defeating them.The basic technology has hardly changed over the last 15 years, and just look at how many Installers are re-discovering SONIC detectors, thus going backwards in technology.When selling, installing, maintaining a security system you have to consider "Risk" this isn't just a factor that affects the initial installation, its a whole of life factor.As a professional installer you have to take this risk into account and as such you can only reccomend that the system is no longer compliant or suitable for the associated "Risk" if you simply attend every year, service the system, collect the money and issue a service docket then you are essentially accepting that the system is suitable for the risk. Yes initially you can log it on the service docket that things need to be improved but how long do you continue to do that for, there is also the point of what the insurance company would say if the property was broken into, who is liable? the Customer for not listening or you for not acting? I agree and yes I do assess associated risk on every job, after being in the industry for a fair time now I use my own judgement, I know when a device is likely to start playing up, I check overall and specific current draws and resistances at EVERY service, I know what signs to look for and If I am not happy then I do notify my customers and give them my recommendations. And as far as I`m concerned I give my systems a far better inspection than I need to, I actually look at each job as if it were my own. If i`d change it in my own home then i advise they do the same. My customers trust me and my judgement.This discussion was about recommending something be changed purely due to its age, I still disagree with this. ........................................................ Dave Partridge (Romec Service Engineer) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monteey Posted September 25, 2004 Share Posted September 25, 2004 Do you guys ever sleep????!!!! Mark Hawks Ex BT Openreach Field Service Now Self employed telecom and data engineer www.mphtelecom.co.uk Also back doing sub contract work in the security industry. Retained firefighter Devon and Somerset Fire and Rescue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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