A-G Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Had a customer last Sunday phone me asking what was on Zone 5 as it had a fault and would not set.This customer had no maintenance since 2007 and back then was a late payment customer. I told them there records have now been removed from our system due to no maintenance agreement. I dont keep stuff for ever. He then asked how will i find out, my answer find the spec i left you when we fitted the system. I tell them the info. is archived and would they like an engineer to attend? If they aren't paying for a contract they get no telephone support.... especially on a Sunday. . . . PM me for access to the SSAIB members discussion area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goncall Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 If i blow the engine up on my car because I don't tighten a nut up properly with the spanner I bought from Halfords can I claim?Yes, probably. no..but if halfords do it,then yes.. I tell them the info. is archived and would they like an engineer to attend? If they aren't paying for a contract they get no telephone support.... especially on a Sunday. do you not attend on non contract rates? put most off but alot still pay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-G Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 do you not attend on non contract rates? put most off but alot still pay Yes, and if they're a paying customer they get very good service ..... but if they pay nowt, they get nowt. . . . PM me for access to the SSAIB members discussion area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistle Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Yes, and if they're a paying customer they get very good service ..... but if they pay nowt, they get nowt. 100% Agreed If you dont pay for a service you dont get one. Although we would attend it would be when we have time and at the moment there would be a 2 week wait we are fully booked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 i cant see how a system no longer maintained is the install companys responsibility,the new maintainer yes,that way get a system installed buy xyz alarms cancel after the first year then get free cover for life.. Im afraid that the original installer / designer / commisioning engineer always holds some liability. The test case i mention is design where it was later proved the design was poor so even though the new company had been servicing it for 3 yrs the insurance company sued the originall installer. ie if i take over a system you have installed and certificated then i am right to assume it is fully complaint, all in areas. I can assume that you have done an ra, and designed to that ra etc. I in theory dont need to do one (if im not issuing a new cert) so all that liability is still on your cert. Maintained by you or not. Now i would liable for servicing and performance issues but you would be liable for design and installation issues as you issued the original cert. The never ends unless you cancel the cert im afraid. So all those companies that do stuff on the cheap or just quick and bad etc and issue a complaince certificate (neednt be an nsi / ssaib cert) and know its gonna be taken over so it dont matter.... sleep tight wont you securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RJBsec Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Are NSI companies required to issue a certificate on takeover? In practice any certificate can only apply to the time of issue, something like an MOT, unless a blatant disregard for risk at the time of installation all sorts of things can happen post-installation let alone post-takeover that will affect the integrity of the installation. If doing a takeover a new firm should also review the current risk and note additional requirements that may apply, customer than can agree or not but it is documented. A takeover without a new risk assessment is a failure of the new company IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-G Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Im afraid that the original installer / designer / commisioning engineer always holds some liability. Surely that can't be open ended. For most things, 6 years is the legal limit of responsibility . . . PM me for access to the SSAIB members discussion area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 im afraid it is open ended and no an nsi company does not have to issue a new cert if a current one exists. just like an ssaib doesnt have to. You and I may do, but there is no requirement. And why would you unless its your design and installation etc? The design (there are other things that are not limited tpo the contract but design was the one used in the test case i mentioned) if wrong is wrong... now, next week, in a decade. For all that period just as with fire the designer is now liable. Its not a problem as long as you only issue certs to systems that deserve them..... but im sure we have all taken over stuff that deosnt. Would i issue a new cert in this circumstance and remove the original cert issuer from all liabilty and take it all on my cert.... er no. doubt you would too AG if you injure a person with your car they can claim on you for ever IF they later have issues that can be proved to that accident. NO time limit on that either im afraid. just as there isnt on this. You may think there is, but id advise you check lol. I was shocked when i found out about it. Not concerned as all of our certed systems are spot on. BUt i bet there a few people who are very concered over this new law securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A-G Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 AGif you injure a person with your car they can claim on you for ever IF they later have issues that can be proved to that accident. NO time limit on that either im afraid. just as there isnt on this. You may think there is, but id advise you check lol. I was shocked when i found out about it. Not concerned as all of our certed systems are spot on. BUt i bet there a few people who are very concered over this new law Venezuela here I come . . . PM me for access to the SSAIB members discussion area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Harris Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 doesnt matter if the maintenance is due or not,customers leave for three reasons,in order.. price,service or moving charge for any you wont get any repeat business and your names worse to the customer than it was,its their kit so they shouldnt be prevented from doing what they want with it or if another company is taken over the system we also prog any code that they request to be progd in so the customer doesnt know it only they do which is then progd to their own code when thay take it over..also to add to this topic,who has on losing a contract progd a daft code in so no one knows it,when removing systems cut all the cables short out of spite..it boils my.. if i remove a system for a competitor i even mark up the cables when removing the panel..do unto others and all that... The thing is, this industry is massively cyclical. Their are always going to be people who migrate. 'Bobs Builders' may be with 'xyz alarms' for years (who are doing a great job). They get a new guy in to look after security and he has an alarm at home with 'zzz alarms' and because of heis good relation with them decides to move it over. It happens a lot in the industry and all of those knowledgable enough know that it gets you nowhere fast by causing difficulty when 'losing' an account. I am not familiar with the OPs site so could not comment on it, I would assume that it is out of contract at the moment which may explain a higher charge? By all means shop around, you may be suprised at the price of taking on the system as well, so consider calling our local office to ask a surveyor to quote. Two things to note: 1 - Thanks to all for the professional responses to the OP (No reply by OP since ) 2 - All names used in this post are fictional and if you have a company called 'zzz alarms' etc then well, free advertising I guess 'J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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