satsuma01 Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 just like i said Whistle,"imo CAT5e only pays on longer or more difficult runs, and where it has to be concealed say in offices or domestics, but it only takes a little more effort to pull in 4 cables than just one - if your organised properly.so why did that prompt such a silly remark by you? if your running cables along a wall it has to be clipped regular intervals, i can run a plastic tube way faster than i can clip into a hard wall and more securely than fixing to a sandstone brick wall. i can then fish in 4 coax's (25mm plastic) with little trouble. so less fixings = less time taken with a neater and far more durable result, and remember i work all on my own and i'm 59 - so i have to be organised if cables are run through lofts especially on commercial premises, they are vulnerable to vermin attacks from squirrels, mice and rats. CAT5e is far far easier for them to chew through and damage than decent RG59, so if the installer is at all prudent then CAT5e needs mechanical protection for a true pro job, so i.e. running cables in conduits or capping and adding to the install time as well the material cost's. not so much protection is required with RG59, very easy to put a kink in CAT5e and problems may occur, much harder to kink coax, and it tends to survive that mishandling better. so i'm not saying your wrong in any way with your opinions (which your fully entitled to) favouring CAT5e, i don't treat it as a 'bed of roses' just stating my own views (which i am also entitled to) for the o/p to best judge for himself. sort of common sense based on my experiences and nothing to do with cattle - or horses for that matter . regs alan on this debate i have to agree with arfur mo here, "If you carry your childhood with you, you never become old. Why rush to end life when happiness is in the blissfulness of childhood innocence.""We all die, the goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will." 07475071344 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 on this debate i have to agree with arfur mo here, oih behave! i have a 'rep' on here, but i'll enjoy it - while it lasts regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 We are about to do an install of about 8 domes and 9 statics on a large industrial building. Will will be running duct grade cat5 everywhere and are intending to send video, RS 485 data and an alarm pair back to the DVR down the same cable. This would make the whole installation so much easier and quicker as most of the runs will be over 200m and not easy runs at that. We will still have to run a twisted mains 1mm for a PA system but sureley this is the way to go. I estimate saving on a week to 2 weeks labour by running so many less cables and believe this easily makes up for the cost of all the baluns we will be using. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 We are about to do an install of about 8 domes and 9 statics on a large industrial building. Will will be running duct grade cat5 everywhere and are intending to send video, RS 485 data and an alarm pair back to the DVR down the same cable. This would make the whole installation so much easier and quicker as most of the runs will be over 200m and not easy runs at that. We will still have to run a twisted mains 1mm for a PA system but sureley this is the way to go. I estimate saving on a week to 2 weeks labour by running so many less cables and believe this easily makes up for the cost of all the baluns we will be using. if you have installed larger sites before using CAT5e then your own experience willout. for me i'm not so keen to have so many egg's in one basket, so i'd also run in coax's in with the other cables for what it cost's as i'm assuming access is a bitch needing scissor lifts etc. but then i'm just a very cautious and fussy old git, so i like a 'fall back' strategy in place. i simply don't care if it cuts into my immediate profits, as the ongoing recommends for a stable system will pay for it imo, where as the 'savings' may well damage my rep and so cost me far more. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satsuma01 Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 if you have installed larger sites before using CAT5e then your own experience willout.for me i'm not so keen to have so many egg's in one basket, so i'd also run in coax's in with the other cables for what it cost's as i'm assuming access is a bitch needing scissor lifts etc. but then i'm just a very cautious and fussy old git, so i like a 'fall back' strategy in place. i simply don't care if it cuts into my immediate profits, as the ongoing recommends for a stable system will pay for it imo, where as the 'savings' may well damage my rep and so cost me far more. regs alan spot on there arfur totally agree coax for video, alarm cable for 12vdc supplies or 2 core flat flex for speed domes 24vac and beldon and alarm cable for data and alarm signals from domes and pir's "If you carry your childhood with you, you never become old. Why rush to end life when happiness is in the blissfulness of childhood innocence.""We all die, the goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will." 07475071344 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barooga Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 spot on there arfur totally agree coax for video, alarm cable for 12vdc supplies or 2 core flat flex for speed domes 24vac and beldon and alarm cable for data and alarm signals from domes and pir's Squirrel proof? Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satsuma01 Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 Squirrel proof? it depends how its run doesnt it "If you carry your childhood with you, you never become old. Why rush to end life when happiness is in the blissfulness of childhood innocence.""We all die, the goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will." 07475071344 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistle Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 If a cable is damaged in a roof space by vermin then its a chargable call out. Its not my problem if my customer have vermin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alterEGO Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 If a cable is damaged in a roof space by vermin then its a chargable call out.Its not my problem if my customer have vermin. Correct, if we all installed as you said arf we would never get a chargable call back. ps: arf, should all t+e be contained in a loft? but what about vermin? no not you, i mean in the loft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satsuma01 Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 If a cable is damaged in a roof space by vermin then its a chargable call out.Its not my problem if my customer have vermin. i also agree with you whistle if vermin are present in lofts and cupboards and floorboards then thats the customers responsibilty but if the cable is installed outside say clipped direct to a wall at low level and a squirrel chews it then surely thats partly the responsibilty of the installer for not giving the cable adaquate protection against vermin etc. "If you carry your childhood with you, you never become old. Why rush to end life when happiness is in the blissfulness of childhood innocence.""We all die, the goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will." 07475071344 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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