hpotter Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 Heh?? handbags a fair point though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kensplace Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 Are prox tags short range rfid devices, if so whats the range on them (inches or feet?) Are they secure ie a rolling code to prevent cloning, or are they like rfid tags on some access control systems where known flaws exist? There not something I would be keen on having,in case someone knicked my keys, or I dropped them near the house and someone saw, or as I have done before - left them in the door. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubit Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 Are prox tags short range rfid devices, if so whats the range on them (inches or feet?)Are they secure ie a rolling code to prevent cloning, or are they like rfid tags on some access control systems where known flaws exist? There not something I would be keen on having,in case someone knicked my keys, or I dropped them near the house and someone saw, or as I have done before - left them in the door. Care to expand?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 cloning a prox card needs access to it to start with and it is far from simple and a lot of inside knowledse is required of the system, just like a key etc. DO you regulaly give your keys to strangers for extended periods of time. Access control is slightly different and high security sites use card and pin. securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kensplace Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 Couple of links on known cloning stuff, probably more stuff on google... http://cq.cx/verichip.pl http://www.infoworld.com/article/07/02/26/...khatrfid_1.html Im hoping the alarm manu's would have this all figure out, but you never know.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 you need serious kit and serious knowledge to copy say a mifare card and if this is a security risk you need an alternative system. But all cloning requires access to the fob. Like i said if you keep it secure it cant be copied. If you are not careful then.... but prox is only one way and if during the risk assessment this is a concern then you need to take that into account. There are ways to remove that risk. securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubit Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 Couple of links on known cloning stuff, probably more stuff on google...http://cq.cx/verichip.pl http://www.infoworld.com/article/07/02/26/...khatrfid_1.html Im hoping the alarm manu's would have this all figure out, but you never know.... HID with their 26bit weigand you don't need to clone them, they have enough duplicates out in circulation already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 dont forget that systems have mutiple logins for the communication. Some systems as link only have 1 so the key can be obtained from the reader. Others require a few logins in the correct order before presenting the public key and only then will teh card transmit its details. So you would need long term access to the reader and card. If teh site was that secure do you think you would notice someone with a laptop? And if your talking intruder they are inside the building and if someone was messing with it....would you accept that. Simple way is to secure the reader or power it down when not needed if using the lower security stuff. As cubit says above, you use what is required depending on risk, some people think a 2 lever dead lock is acceptable to secure a door, others do not. etc securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubit Posted August 24, 2008 Share Posted August 24, 2008 you need serious kit and serious knowledge to copy say a mifare card and if this is a security risk you need an alternative system. But all cloning requires access to the fob. Like i said if you keep it secure it cant be copied. If you are not careful then.... but prox is only one way and if during the risk assessment this is a concern then you need to take that into account. There are ways to remove that risk. And are London Transport panicking??? Errr, no. I got hold of the info documents from NXP and they ain't overly worried either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justin Posted August 25, 2008 Share Posted August 25, 2008 I think this is a fair point.If for instance a woman had her handbag stolen there is a very good chance that something within that bag would reveal her address. I wouldn't recommend anyone to write their alarm code on a tag and keep it on their keyring and that is pretty much the same thing as a prox tag in my opinion. I am also in that camp. Never liked the idea of people carrying fobs which are really sealed codes. It's not hard to imagine someones keys being snatched, having their car whisked off the carpark at the back of the chinese and the ever reliable sat nav finding them the quickest way 'home'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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