Guest Posted November 21, 2005 Share Posted November 21, 2005 Hmmmmmm been thinking some moreExit/Entry perfumery Probably best if you stop thinking now. I don't know why you thought the rules would be logical or fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy_S Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 Hi All, Many thanks for the various replies. I have now written to the builders alarm company and asked them the question and will post any reply I receive. , Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MSI New York Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 You always install an internal sounder, especially if you install smoke detectors, CO detectors, etc. What are you going to do if you happen to be asleep while your house is burning? The alarm should wake you up. In New Jersey, building inspectors stand inside every bedroom, close the door, and have us set the alarm, and if they don't feel the siren is loud enough to wake a person up, they won't pass you. Most alarm related regulations in New Jersey are stupid, but I fully agree with this one. You always install an internal sounder, especially if you install smoke detectors, CO detectors, etc. What are you going to do if you happen to be asleep while your house is burning? The alarm should wake you up. In New Jersey, building inspectors stand inside every bedroom, close the door, and have us set the alarm, and if they don't feel the siren is loud enough to wake a person up, they won't pass you. Most alarm related regulations in New Jersey are stupid, but I fully agree with this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb-eye Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Hi MSI New York The UK does not accept fire detection connected to the intruder system although this often happens as a customer enhanced feature especially for monitoring. UK fire systems are totally autonomous. Jef Customers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy_S Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Hi All, I have now received a formal reply from the alarm company which reads: The following specification is for the installation of an AUDIBLE INTRUDER ALARM SYSTEM at the above mentioned premises. The proposed installation is in accordance with BS4737 Part 1 1986. The company is a 'Quality Assured Installer' on the roll of the National Approval Council for Security Systems and is authorised to issue to the Customer a 'Certificate of Compliance' upon completion. There then follows a detailed description of every zone in the system and then it continues: CONTROLS 11. The multi zone control panel 12. An internal audible warning device will be fitted to the entry/exit and 24 hour protection circuits 13. The control panel to be located in utility 14. The remote keypad to be located in the hall 15. A double skinned external self activating sounder with strobe and reassurance light 16. External sounder 20 minute cut-off timer 17. blah blah 18. blah blah 19. blah blah 20. XXXXX Alarm Systems Ltd have been awarded Certification to British Standards EN ISO 9001:2000 and NSI Quality Schedule SSQS 101 and is a NACOSS Gold Installer of Security Systems. So just to be clear, when the alarm is armed, there is a very feable continual sound comes from the keypad, and when the alarm is triggered, the is an equally feable continual tone comes from the keypad. This is the same volume and tone as you get when pressing the keys to arm/disarm. There is no other sounder, speaker or siren inside the house. The sound from the keypad cannot be heard from more than about 10ft away and certainly cannot be heard outside the front door which is 2ft away. My laymans observations on the letter received are: 1. That they quote BS4737 which is now a defunct standard I understand? 2. No 17 of the controls mentions "An internal audible warning device will be fitted to the entry/exit and 24 hour protection circuits" but this surely can't be the keypad tone? Any advice on how I should move this forward or where I stand. Thanks, Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RICHL Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 My laymans observations on the letter received are:1. That they quote BS4737 which is now a defunct standard I understand? 2. No 17 of the controls mentions "An internal audible warning device will be fitted to the entry/exit and 24 hour protection circuits" but this surely can't be the keypad tone? Any advice on how I should move this forward or where I stand. Thanks, Andy 1 - BS4737 was withdrawn on the 1/10/2005, so it is OK for your system to be fitted to that. 2 - yep thats it! In summary, no doubt you have a decent quality system, properly installed to the relevant standard. But clearly it has been done to a price. My advice to you would be to look for an installer to maintain it for you and add the speaker to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j.paul Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 2 - yep thats it! If thats the case, then I think they need to change their specification There are no stupid questions, but there are a LOT of inquisitive idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy_S Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Just checked and found that the alarm was installed on the 11th Oct 2005 so this was after the withdrawel of BS4737? Does this make a difference? Whilst I am happy to employ a reputable alarm company to fit an internal sounder to the system and maintain it thereafter, I am also keen to get things delivered properly and to the relevant standards. From what I am reading, it is not cut and dry that they should have fitted an internal sounder to the system? Do not all their affiliations, qualifications and accreditations suggest that they should be complying with all current standards AND good practice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 I would not waste any more time with the installer, as mentioned before get a reputable, recognised company in to take over the contract and see if they have cut any more corners (to save a couple of quid). You will sleep better in the long run. Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Posted November 23, 2005 Share Posted November 23, 2005 Anything specced before October 1st and installed after (until about December) can be to the former British Standard. Even if it was to the EN, it would probably only be a Grade 1 Clearly these guys didn't just walk in after October and stick in the alarm - they may have quoted 2 years ago. Not always fair to blame the installer - the builders probably completely screwed them down on price. However, it is VERY annoying that builders get alarms put in that are very rarely suitable for the person who moves in (i.e. bells only when the client has to replace the panel to have it monitored). Why don't you call the alarm company that fitted it - or as Norman says, choose your own. Unless you have specifically paid for the alarm as an additional option not sure how much you can anyway. Especially if you were not the client, which it does not seem you were. Zak Tankel - Managing Director - Security First (UK) - www.securityfirst.uk.com Disclaimer: Any comments or opinions expressed by me are my own as a member of the public and not of my employer or Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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