Steve Howard Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 So ultimately its about finding the right comms method(s) that blends reliability with cost and ease of install. I guess what is important is trying to differentiate in an intelligent way between the loss of a comms path through benign and malignant actions. Clearly impossible in most cases (ie is the digger killing the BT line an accident or not). Is there any reason in situations where the cost of comms is trivial or zero (ie GPRS/ GSM and IP) why the line checks aren't much more frequent - like seconds apart not hours? Has anyone ever gone down the line of terrestrial infrastrusture-less comms like satellite mentioned aboe (the hardware exists for other markets for sub £100 retail)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimcarter Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Yes to an extent. But you certainly can determine where a failure has likely to have occurred if as an ATS provider, the diagnostic information is available, and more importantly, who is responsible for the fix. It's something my support team do. With IP based signalling (and indeed with RedCARE classic on PSTN) using wired or radio, polling can be much faster (and again, yes that is what our own ATS does). Radio can be a little more tricky as bandwidth is used and that's how you get billed. But, yes GPRS can (and is) polled in seconds/minutes. As I say above, using another form of transmission such as Satellite (as you point out) is fine, but it will still require infrastructure to run on and therefore have it's own unique set of fail criteria. I guess burning up in the atmosphere would be a pretty substantial failure scenario! Jim Carter WebWayOne Ltd www.webwayone.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 Wouldn't the dish be vulnerable to attack just the same? securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrHappy Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Wouldn't the dish be vulnerable to attack just the same? reaching for google..... How does a satellite phone work? Satellite phones must have "line-of-sight" to the satellites in order to operate. This means the antenna on the phone must be outdoors with nothing solid obstructing it's view to the sky. Anything solid can block the phone to satellite signal. e.g. Trees, buildings, hills or mountains, vehicles, etc. line of sight sound worse than GSM ? Mr Veritas God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Howard Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Wouldn't the dish be vulnerable to attack just the same? A dish would yes, but for really low bandwidth stuff like this a simple 'spot' antenna would be dine - about 3 inches across and unobtrusive. It would need to be line of sight yes (and thus external)... just another option where there is a real/ assumed risk to failure or interference with terrestrial infrastrusture. As for the satellite burning up, how many times in 20 years have you heard of Astra/ Sky doing that - for mainstream civilian sats its very rare / unheard of. I''d also take slight issue with GPRS polling being slow as bandwith costs - its does, but if you are paying more than say £20 a year for a SIM that is used for M2M (machine to machine) like this then you are being overcharged! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb-eye Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 but if you are paying more than say £20 a year for a SIM that is used for M2M (machine to machine) like this then you are being overcharged! Pleased to be pointed in the right direction I considered satellite for rural Ireland. It was cost prohibative and flaky. In point the last time i looked FWI were no longer in buisness. Customers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 Its not just the sim though else its unmanaged. Id assume the costs for the providers red are, dualcom webway etc are data charges, pstn rental charges for the recieving end as well as other infrastructure costs. I suppose sattalite is an option where there is no GSM available securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb-eye Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Its not just the sim though else its unmanaged. Id assume the costs for the providers red are, dualcom webway etc are data charges, pstn rental charges for the recieving end as well as other infrastructure costs. I suppose sattalite is an option where there is no GSM available screw managed! Customers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 Yes but then you need to find a product that passes lps1277 or the insurers won't accept it securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Howard Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Pleased to be pointed in the right direction I considered satellite for rural Ireland. It was cost prohibitive and flaky. In point the last time i looked FWI were no longer in buisness. There's lots of companies who are effectively aggregators / resellers in the M2M markets - supporting everything from 'Tesco Freezer alarm' to 'oops the dam has broken' type stuff. Even in tiny (20 off) quantities we were offered multi-network SIMS with enough data to enable frequent 'heartbeat' sends to prove the link alive in the £2- £4 a month reange. We were monitoring remote equipment (including ironically comms towers themselves!) - but the basics for a premises alarm are the same I guess). For satellite I was not suggesting the 'broadband over satellite' type systems that offer 10Mbit speeds - ie NOT the likes of Tooway etc (although they still have their place for remote and temporary stuff). More like systems that used in Spot ( google 'findmespot') that are used in safety of life applications are are really quite resilient for almost no money - $200 for the kit and a years service, even at consumer level. The satellites themselves and the ground stations are duplicated, so as close to 100% as you might reasonably get. Having said that I have no idea what commercial alarm IP system cost to buy or run, (£5 a month? £10? £30?) as no one have replied to my enquiries yet!! (Hint hint!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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