Brian c Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 Isnt that the point of engineering manuals?? That's why I don't think we should supply them If you don't know......ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 That's why I don't think we should supply them this is assuming the customer can actually read the users manual of course..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 A decision has to be made as to whether the site will remain primarily a facility for members of the trade, manufacturers etc to exchange information or whether it will be open-shop for any Tom, Dick or Harry to get information on our industry.The fact that information is available elsewhere should not dictate what is made available here. hi jef, with respects sorry mate, but the above is prevaricating by exageration, so seemingly avoiding the issue raised in the o/p i.e. how would having a manual lower the security of any system in any way? the fact is most control systems are designed to be 'fit all' solutions these days even small panels, this means they can be almost eternally configureable in dozens even hundreds of ways to suit any application or whim. that means any information within these enginner manuals is 'general guidance' information on a particular program option, not demanding if that option is ever used. the user manuals are broad advice not absolute. for instance, i as a habit may always use zone 1 as the e/e, another installer thinking this is a default setting on that range and so is a risk issue, would make zone 1 a pab and use zone 5 as e/e on his systems and so on. i hope you see what i mean, i seek your opinion which i do value if not always agree with, so bouncing opinions between two dedicated engineers with wildly differing attitudes is illuminating for all imo. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 A lot of engineering manuals have defaulting information in them. yes they do, but having the manual will not allow you acces to the panel to default it. the action of default will clear all the codes, so the client might just notice he can't set anymore. if the system is set how did we get to the panel to default it? i think that completes the loop nicely regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alarm Guard Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 If it isn't broken, don't fix it! I think we have got the balance correct on the site and I wouldn't like to see it changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian c Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 My way of thinking is.... A decent commercial monitored system should be very hard or even impossible to defeat, even with a good deal of knowledge. Some monitored commercials can be defeated quite easily with a medium amount of knowledge. Most bells only house alarms can be defeated fairly quickly with a little bit of knowledge. Fair enough they may ring, but if you are able to default and unset it within a minute or so, a lot of people will ignore it. If a clever crook has access to manuals, they may be able to work out how and which systems could be defeated. Supplying some info does not carry the same risk IMO. For example, the recent post about adding a RKP to a galaxy.....I see no real security risk in answering this guys question, however I don't think we should give him the manual. If you don't know......ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RICHL Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 yes they do, but having the manual will not allow you acces to the panel to default it. Yes it will. Which is why the manuals should not be available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 You work outside of the regulated field of installation practice, I do not expect you to look at things from a truly professional standpoint. pardon Roger! why this bile, unregulated never equals un-professional imo i've seen and worked for to many regulated copanies to know the truth but this is the public area so lets keep that our little secret. an ill informed and silly answer, based mainly on spite and assumption, and with no actual knowledge of how i conduct my buisness, or how many installs have you actually inspected of mine then? so just answer the politly put question - politely and with the respct shown to you like a real man would do,especially if you wish respect in turn from this forum let alone me. i suggest you draw from your vast and obviously superior array of regulated 'professional' wisdom and show us how, that should be very simple for given your qualifications. make not only me, but everone else agree with you - as if you had any such talent! so i assume that's to hard for you? and you realised you have no real answer, so resort to cat calling - on a simple question , based on the truth and fear 'arfur's' got you good and proper answer - or find a real excuse not to - regulated or not!. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 True, who is going to be able to cut off a Redcare and GSM with a large book in hand?Go Georg, tell us.......... ... As much as it was a good answer, lets not go posting ideas in public, eh Georgy?!! I think it was a rhetorical question! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted July 23, 2006 Share Posted July 23, 2006 Yes it will. Which is why the manuals should not be available. ok tell me how richl?, i've not seen a manual that works by prox - yet , but then i don't use galaxei's. so soz mate, you gotta exsplain that statement. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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