charlie6

Forget these posts they are just confusing you, go out and buy a reel of cable and get cracking on your install. Bye.

"...Especially with 2-way wireless..." It doesn't exist. I mesh detectors are supposedly able to transceive one to the other but that's about it really, won't solve the current problem... and no one appears to be addressing that problem at the moment. I'll make a suggestion to you SKJ, make an offer to anyone on this forum, anyone. ' I shall purchase a brand new wireless system of anyone's choosing provided that in a written contract they agree to refund my money in full plus £100 inconvenience fee if there is a false alarm at my premises due to 'jamming' within the first twelve months from the date of installation ' There shall be many replies to this post. Sadly I shall not be around to see those amusing replies. Best Wishes SKJ.

Hello SKJ, I'll see if you have replied to my post later, in the meantime try not to allow deliberate confusion over the original issue to cloud your thinking. I shall be moving on shortly, possibly today since my research project is completed, so I'll wish you the best of luck in all you do. Thanks for the honour of allowing me to be of some help. Best Wishes.

Hello Benny, "..thats not correct there is a bs std now for cable, en does not have a cable std.." whatever, just go with the information from the manufacturers as mentioned previously..it's no big deal as long as you have 10ohms @ 100mtrs the rest may be viewed by most people as 'nit picking'... but it's up to you.

Hello SKJ, I'm sorry but I need to leave this post. I trust you shall not allow yourself to become too confused. Before doing so however, let me ask you the distance between your front door and the main road and also whereabouts on your property the control panel is mounted and it's distance from the main road. Having received that information (which I am fairly sure of without the answers) You shall most definitely be in the same position were you to buy new equipment.

Hello SKJ, Although I mentioned that 418 is fairly wide, I'm sorry to inform you that even the newer narrow band, were you to buy brand new, at a phenomenol cost if it was trade installed, would not cure your present problem. Both the 500r and 500r+ are at 418, the only discernible difference of any weight is the facility to add a digital communicator to the r+ so this needn't concern you.

Have a chat with your engineer about the possibilites of putting a push button (won't bother explaining), it's not more that a door bell press outside the front door and weigh up the options with him, he is the best person to advise you on this otherwise the issue may result in you being more confused.

Hello QSXS, At eight quid it certainly is worth a try, there are a lot of old fashioned methods I still use for those very purposes though...still not complaining for eight quid. You are quite right, the cables should be hidden but there are also ways to make it virtually invisible if neccessary. I won't bother you with the details though. There is no magic in running cable, a diyer could do it as well, and sometimes better, than those in the trade. Take Care.

Hello Benny, I am checking out the cable distributors thoughts on their particular brands and apparently they conform to a European standard and despite not being copper in total (the cores are aluminium with a copper coating) they reach the standard of 10 ohms at 100 metres, which is more than adequate for a domestic property..so, no worries on branded there. I should imagine that you would be paying a great deal more for solid copper (keeping the costs down)but it's your choice at the end of the day.

Hello SKJ, as I mentioned earlier this is a jamming problem where the panel detects an external frequency which is very close or the same as the frequencies used by that panel. The The radio operating frequency is 418MHz with a bandwidth of 200kHz and at one time conformed to BS6799 class III, it also complied at that time with the nacoss codes of practise. Now forget the rest of the gobbledegook and just look at the 200kHz bandwidth. In simple terms this means 200,000 cycles per second and is not regarded as a narrow bandwidth by today's standards, therefore there is a far greater chance that an external frequency within this window should jam your panel. Now, you may say, since this is the case then I should buy a new panel. In doing so, you would also need to buy a new batch of detectors which shoots your costs up considerably, and that's just the equipment. Although virtually anyone can install 'wireless' should you opt for a 'professional' (in inverted commas) to do the job for you then add a considerable sum to the cost of your new equipment before you start. So, that's the bad news. The good news is that you have almost found the problem, in that you are beginning to look for certain cars and at certain times. One of the golden rules in wireless is to avoid metal, but I have often used simple kitchen foil, not to keep the signals in, but to keep jamming signals out, I'll explain that a little later. We are at that point then where the panel detects a jamming signal when a car (and I'm reckoning on a particular car) is leaving the development. Do you ever use too much rev's when starting your car and driving away..I know I do... and excessive revving of a car engine is 'leaning on' the 200kHz bandwidth. Now, I'm not suggesting that you have actually found the problem but I am sure that you are 'on the case'. You mentioned:- "Why would it trigger an alarm at particular times and not others? Is there a particular car or device active at the precise time the sensor is trying to send a signal back to the panel?.." Every probability that this is indeed the case. Have you considered asking your installer to reduce the external warning device time for a short period ? Keep digging, you're getting there.

"...It is possible, that a 'jamming frequency' from the property next door may be responsible if that signal were strong enough.." Sorry, I should have explained that the jamming frequency could be coming from virtually anything, not their alarm. It could emanate from the weird and wonderful sound systems they are using these days, or a CB radio, or a Freezer kept in their garden shed and so on. The housing development has a lot of traffic so good on you for spotting that all too often overlooked aspect, and you appear to be on the receiving end of all of it. You could be putting yourself 'between a rock and a hard place' on this one, but it might be worth getting your installer to reduce the time duration of the external warning device for a week or so if he can't find the problem immediately. The plus side is that the neighbours don't get annoyed, the minus side is you have less sounder time in the event of a genuine burglary attempt. Keep looking (and listening), keep logging the times.

"...but surely a £300 alarm is better than no alarm. A Yale would be better than nothing.." Around the £300 mark should get you everything you need and don't concern yourself with cable size, but don't buy 'unbranded' cheap cable, and it doesn't need to be CQR branded, there are lots of branded cables out there. Usually, a warning device uses five (sometimes six) connections..it is wise to use a cable with more cores than you actually need so eight core is about right. You don't need anyone to check your work, that's just defeating the object of keeping the costs down, just follow the instructions and make good cable connections. Observe my notes on signal attenuation when fitting wireless, for example, a signal is attenuated by one brick wall, it is attenuated even more if there are two brick walls between the device and panel. If your neighbour is happy having the panel in a cupboard or under the stairs and not getting wireless faults then give it a try if you want. You could also be a bit nosey with your neighbour's system to get a few tips there. Yale sell thousands of alarm systems, and I doubt that they are having thousands of fault calls, the fault, when it occurs, is due to poor positioning of devices and internal and external influences, installed correctly you should have very few problems with a Yale, if any, I have cleared up many problems with badly positioned devices on both Yale and Micromark. Not particularly fussy on some of their solar powered warning devices, try to avoid them.

Hello SKJ, There's not a problem there, the detectors go to sleep in order to save their batteries and it is actually the other way around... they would prefer 'not to be disturbed'. A system installed professionally just eight years ago should see you right for another few years. and since it is actually setting at night this tells me that there is very little wrong with the installation and panel. Get it checked over by the chap who replaced your batteries if you would be more comfortable with that, but this has the hallmarks of transmission interference so it could be worth continuing to observe since you live at the entrance to a housing development (recently built probably). It is possible, that a 'jamming frequency' from the property next door may be responsible if that signal were strong enough. observation, observation, until the fault is tracked down..

hello Rawson, I haven't read anything in your post which suggests a problem with the front door, however 'tapping' it is only a temporary measure.A front door contact is exposed to extremes although it is 'indoors'. It should be dismounted and the connections checked for corrosion and cleaned up, but I don't see that this has any relevance to your present dilemma so you can leave that for now. As mentioned in my previous post, look at the user instructions in order to extinguish the 'chime', it's only two key presses. You should be able then to reset by pressing your user code twice. It appears, as I said earlier, that the problem is minor and your panel should be good for another few years. Some people at the first sign of a problem tend to pay good money for a replacement panel rather than solve the very minor problem.

There's not much wrong here, the panel is responding and should last for years. Your clue to the problem is here "...mainly in evening around 8 -9 PM.." Check if there is anything happening in close proximity to the property at that time...even a lorry or motorbike passing... Check inside your property also..You'll probably need two people to check these things (with one remaining at the panel to view the status)..Have you had any alterations to the property or new furnishings perhaps ? If it was just the one device causing this problem, which I very much doubt, the status indicators at the panel would not show all zones and panic. A 'off road' motorbike revving past the property would cause the external warning device to sound.. don't panic, just look for anything which may be interfering with the signals which the panel is supposed to receive..most problems with wireless can be solved purely by observation.

Hello Rawson, there's not much to go wrong with this panel, used it with no problems whatsoever. brilliant panel just goes on working for years. Check your user instructions first of all to get rid of the chime light and we'll go from there. If you haven't renewed the standby battery within the last say three or four years you should do so now, regardless of it's reading.

".....So when you are a running a cabled alarm in a house, do you really avoid all other cables coming anywhere near? Surely you're going to run near at some point when a cable runs the other way to a lighting cable in the loft etc? I'm not bitching, I'm honestly purely wondering!..." I would reccomend a parallel distance of a minimum of 30 centimetres (1 foot). Do not run cables on joists immediately above a fluorescent light. Cables may pass across mains but not parallel. Avoid spurring off the kitchen ring main for the control panel (possible problems with fridge freezer motors etc)..if you are qualified run a new fuse at the consumer unit. Attempt to keep the receiver as high as possible from the ground.It is not advisable to mount a wireless panel 'under the stairs' or in a 'closet' or 'cupboard' or in a basement. Observe the fact that foil backed plasterboard, brick walls, large wall mirrors, boilers, central heating pipe clusters, mains cable clusters, each attenuate the signal. Avoid placing a pir on a wall immediately behind a television set, keep the detectors at least one metre from similar devices. Avoid connecting into the mains where a floodlight is known..Attempt to position the receiver in a central position with regard to the transmitters..carry out a fabric test, although normal plasterboard would attenuate far less than concrete..Plan the system with several drawings and notes before commencing the installation. You say you want a message to your mobile..that's fair enough.. How far away from the property will you be when your mobile informs you of an intruder...or do you have decent neighbours who look out for your interests.

"..I have the vibration connected but not the reed (door)?.." Have you lined up the magnet for the contact..If you put your ear to the reed and with one hand, slowly move the magnet towards and away from the reed you should be able to hear a feint click as the reeds open and close...that's provided you want to use it, but it's there so why not use it.

"...as long as your installer is competant and experienced that is what really matters, the quality of install and support makes the biggest difference in the end.." Couldn't agree more.

Thankyou so much for your insight and excellent post..Well done, you are a breath of fresh air.

Most certainly, but not at your command, since it would be most convenient for you, wouldn't it ? I'll just post a copy of yet another threat:- "...Charlie take heed of this warning, you have already been asked to stop..." Stop what ?

Admin I have posted two replies, essentially to yourself, both are not showing for some reason. and so to:- "...yet c6 you say you want to listen to advice from others that know?.." If 'tell him to mind his own business' is technical advice, particularly from one who refers to Charlie as a liar, blagger and bull*******, then it is time for me to re-consider my position. There is a gross failure on my part to comprehend where the technical advise is found. And it is to 'technical advice' which I may have referred in the past.

Timmo sounds like a gentleman to me, I decide on whether a question is simple or not, Pointless you attempting to advise me.

Try reading the previous posts Norman...it helps !!

Been told off for answering a question with a question, but there are literally hundreds on the site, still, I accept admonishment for my sins. I am an old man Timmo, been round the block a few times, I am here to learn and gain insight into modern practise by the site experts such as yourself..and possibly to suggest answers to the occasional query...Here's the 'answering a question with a question' bit..This isn't a leading question is it Timmo ?