Guest SnowBum Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 My concern would be post coming through letter box (assuming you have one). A cold source ie letters or large letter/envelope can sometimes activate a PIR.Apart from that you seemed to have done a good job for a amateur. As others have commented the thing about multiple detectors on zones is 'bad practice' but you obviously have the knowledge to fault find the problem if one occurs. If we did that as a proffessinal job we would get criticsed by our inspectorate(s) hence the comments you receieved. As a service engineer myself if i need to attend a premises where a pir has activated there nothing worse than finding a zone with 2 (or more!) sensors on it. If you are lucky they are latching type but more often they are not and have just been wired like this for cheapness and quickness. It is a touchy point therefore with most of us. But your posts have indicated to me at least that you planned your installation and have a diagnostic plan if oyu do have faults well done paul Our letter box is in the Porch door, our front door goes into the porch and doesn't have a letter box so i think i'm safe with that. I did plan my installation as best as i could and spent a good few hours going over it and walking the house looking at heat sources to try to locate the PIRs in the best place (not the easiest). So from the feedback i've been getting i seem to have got it mostly right (apart from 2 PIRs in zones). Thanks again for your input all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 You are right. 2 PIR's on 1 zone is fine...... As a professional engineer I like to try for the perfect solution, which is 1 detector per zone and that is why I and others have tendered this advise.Paul QFA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 Its only PIRs?????Slightly different to an expensive machine. Well i'm following the manual so other than an IF one of the PIRs on the zones with 2 on it goes a bit iffy i can't see that i should have any problems. Hi Snowbum, if we miswire or miss program a system the potential loss is not just a fried conrol unit, and as it is more likely to happen in a large buisness, factory or house dripping with valuable art works on the wall - price up a dodgy old painting some time, then go white when you find out its worth million's. from what you say, i would suggest you to combine the 2 door contacts on one zone, but then i'd have worked out how many zones i wanted before buying the panel, and allowed enough zones plus had spares for later - so just tell me you thought pathe's , how do you program TNC machines then? do you work out before hand which action is first and how many steps or is simple maths not in the programming remit of you proffesion? now look and see, we can all chuck out spitefull putdown 'superior' remarks, so everyone, just calm down, wind your knecks in and go back to offering (and also asking for) some help please. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 ... (...Great fun!)Paul especially during weekends.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 and here is a prime example of the possible outcome of not sticking to that rule.On Saturday I attended a business that had been let down by their existing (now ex_)maintaining company. The problem was that they couldn't set the alarm. One zone was showing fault. The paperwork just showed that there were 8 doors split over 3 circuits plus movement detectors on individual circuits. Of course the fault was on a door circuit, but finding out which door(s) and on what circuit took a long time. (Retail premises with customers in and out and doors repeatedly opening and closing.....Great fun!) Paul Hi Paul, now we are in my kind of 'old school' servicing territory, so i'd fit spare magnets with tape to each door, or remove one screw and hold magnet on that way, get a 'clear' then check each door in turn, if possible with staff member if controls are far away or use the 'chime' facility. a good alternative on 'loop' systems put doors in series with sab drive and aux neg, when doors are closed then sab rings and you can hear it go 'clear' B) . (or use a spare pietzo sounder). if EOL use handy transistorised relay and put in series with input, use springs for bell or pietzo. same go's for lace security wiring or frames - makes it's a doddle - no meter is needed regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 The mains is a direct feed from the consumer unit from its own 6A MCB through a 3A fused outlet box. ooops! errr no Snowbum! from another thread as i undertood it (i'm not a sparks) you can add a spur to an existing ring main without any cert issues (apart from wet area's), but if you fit a new ring or circuit (which you have done) then you need certification. totally mad i know for 6 ft of cable, but thats what regs tend to be - like the law very blunt no allowance made for the sharper tool of common sense! regs alan. If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amateurandy Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 ooops! errr no Snowbum!from another thread as i undertood it (i'm not a sparks) you can add a spur to an existing ring main without any cert issues (apart from wet area's), but if you fit a new ring or circuit (which you have done) then you need certification. totally mad i know for 6 ft of cable, but thats what regs tend to be - like the law very blunt no allowance made for the sharper tool of common sense! regs alan. Did he say it was new? Did he say that he fitted it himself? Did he say he wasn't certified? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 But very profitable Georg Ker-ching!... Ker-ching Ker-ching! just came from changing a tamper switch.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 Did he say it was new? Did he say that he fitted it himself? Did he say he wasn't certified? Hi amatuerandy, i take my clues from his own words -: The mains is a direct feed from the consumer unit from its own 6A MCB through a 3A fused outlet box. so yes a new circuit is indicated - hence my reply if he did not fit it himself why would he mension it? if a sparky did it we all hope it was properly 'certed' for regs. he don't sayi f he is or is not certified himself, but he works on TNC machines so will have some electrical knowledge and possible trainning, but i have to assume not to be safe for him and me. now wheres that 'cats backside' got to - i'm expecting some more 'in and outs'? regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 Problem is with tamper switches and fuses the part costs very little, but you still need to get to site, find the fault, repair, raise paperwork and get back to the office. We would charge securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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