ttstick
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Posts posted by ttstick
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2 minutes ago, MrHappy said:
@ttstick looking at the screw heads I'd assume your use the same screwdriver to terminate the button & the keypad ?
If so I doubt the button or jb's connections will remain tight ?
The texecom supplied resistor have really thing legs
The cable & resistors are really short, do you terminate the cable conductor with a twist ?
They do look a bit rough admittedly, I was using a terminal driver that probably was too small for the job on the terminals, re-tightened with a better, broader flathead though.
I gave them a bit of a twist to make sure they stayed in form as they went around the screw but nothing too savage, I did consider ring crimping but I think they'd have been too big to fit between the terminals, or at least interfere with the cover fitting/ tamper leaf clearances, and the cores are that small the crimps could've just added to the problem.
Been sat at 2.19k for the past few hours now so see what happens in a few days time...!
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41 minutes ago, sixwheeledbeast said:
Bit of a daft place to fit a PA, you have to remove the PA from the wall to check anything inside the keypad. this means any readings you have taken in your OP are likely from the keypad and not with a meter too.
It's also not where the cable entry is on the keypad you have made your own hole in the casing, it's unlikely but the PCB of the keypad maybe pressing on the cable causing an intermittent mystery resistance via some keypad component.
I would say if anything the resistors are clamped too tight up to the ceramic this is where they are weaker and more likely to break. You could easily wire that double pole at G2 and job done with no discrete components flapping about inside.
As for the PA in question I don't use them so can't comment but i would be inclined to use something more modern style, reed switches in PA's are so last century...
Not really much else place to put it since the keypad is essentially "boxed in" by CH pipes and LV cabling, any other location would've put it too close to LV cabling or put it straight across CH pipework unfortunately, but yeah it will be a pain to get the RKP off, didn't think of that! Fingers crossed that doesn't start playing up.
Had a ratch around on the connections and it looks like one of the cable cores was a little shredded where I'd tightened it down too much, remade it off and checked the other terminations, see what happens. If it goes again I'll go the double pole route I think, got enough play in the cable. I metered across each termination and the resistances seemed stable, but I take the point about the potential for damaging the ceramic.
One thing I noticed was some of the magnetic material had come loose from the mount on the PA button shaft, I do wonder if enough of that flapping about could have caused the reed to mooch around a bit.
I did notice when tightening down there was almost an inverse bell curve between resistance and tightness, too loose and the resistance was high (obviously), just about finger tight and the resistance was spot on, another quarter turn and it started going up towards 3k/4k again.
Cheers for the input!
25 minutes ago, Logan said:Whats the point of the PA button above keypad as the keypad has a built in PA button by pressing 1 and 3
Easier actuation than pulling down the keypad cover and aiming for numbers, generally more recognisable function/ device and easier to operate when unfamiliar with the system.
Same reason emergency stops are a thing.
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As requested!
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1 hour ago, al-yeti said:
You need an installer
3 zones needing a revisit on a freshly wired and installed Premier Elite 48 isn't that bad is it! :^)
The JB (added a bit more to the tamper actuator) and first PA (tightening the cover a bit more) seems to be fine now to be honest, just that remaining pesky PA that I'm hoping will be resolved by a bit of tightening up.
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24 minutes ago, Logan said:
Dont froget to stamp on the broken one
I normally burn a few resistors to keep away the spirits too...
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6 minutes ago, datadiffusion said:
Yes but sometimes you just want to get in and out and not have to go back, and with the tact option usually comes proper terminals not
screws. I find esp. when you are installing a system to crappy builder installed CCA you can just forget using screws anyway.
I'll take the cover off the PA that recently activated and give everything a retighten and check (and make sure the cover is tightened down proper) but yeah I think if it fails soak I'll put in a G3 microswitched replacement instead.
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I'm beginning to think the leaf tampered stuff is more trouble than it's worth definitely...
The two products are the Knight KP4 G2 Double Push PA button and Knight 8 - Way Junction Box.
The Knight KP4 is wall mounted in a hallway, nowhere near any EM fields that could interfere with the reed, not in sunlight or above a heater or anything but it drops a few degrees at night, had one random activation where it went up to 4k and wavered for a bit between 3k/4k and then settled back down to 2k, but I did notice when installing if you don't screw them down tight enough the tamper resistance can slowly drift/ creep.
The Knight JB mounted at high level in a garage, again nowhere near any EM fields that could induce EMF, not in sunlight etc. but the timing of the fault coincided with when the sun would start heating the garage up (again a few degrees, nothing huge). Same case of random activation(s) where it'd go up to 4k but this happened a few times. Took off the cover, cut a bit more out of the JB where a small grommit entered just in case this was expanding and pushing the cover up a bit, added a bit more to the tamper actuator so it had more travel, this seems to have done the job and not had any more issues for X weeks now.
The timing might just be coincidence in terms of temperature fluctuations but not really any clue on anything else that could've caused it, the rest of the installation (around 20 other wired FSL zones) is rock solid and the cabling itself tests fine.
I have a few more of the same products installed elsewhere on the property and had zero issues with them.
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I've recently had three separate issues where the leaf tampers (two on PA buttons and one on a small junction box) ended up causing wavering resistances (2k2/4k7 system reporting 4k0 or 9k0 resistances randomly) and caused tamper/ intruder alarms. I've tried everything possible to ensure terminations are secure and tight, conductors are making good contact with the terminals and the covers of the components are screwed down tight (not loose, not over tightened), in one case I resorted to adding a little more length onto the tamper leg to ensure it has good contact on the leaf which seems to have worked (and the tamper still functions as required).
The only correlation I can see is that each fault occurred when the building was warming up/ cooling down; am I doing something wrong here? Could temperature changes cause these issues?
Never had this problem with microswitch tampers that I can recall so I would like to think it's not my s**t wiring.
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After flicking through the Texecom Premier Elite manual (obviously I've too much time on my hands), I come across the "Remote LED control" function and it got me thinking as to what applications this actually could be used in?
I assume the function is remote control of all detector/ sounder/ equipment LEDs on the network through the LED control terminals on the Texecom detectors, but other than disabling the LEDs post- walk test for G3 installations, I can't think of any other application?
Can anyone give any clues/ uses of this function they've found in the past/ present?
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I'm hesistant to use beams as they seem fairly easy to bypass, if the intruder knew they were there.
It'd also require the running of an additional power supply to the second unit, looking at a few on the market.
With a PIR/ MW detector, it has more blanket coverage and is much more difficult to bypass, as well as being a smaller unit which requires only one cable.
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After completing a fairly extensive domestic installation, my focus is now towards the exterior of the property.
I've been looking at the GJD Mini Opal External PIR Detector or Pyronix High security tri-technology outdoor detector as a potential component of monitoring the outdoor areas, to act mainly as a pre-alarm (e.g. chimes and/ or activating internal sounders only). The detector would be mounted to monitor the access route to a part of my home which does have some foliage etc. surrounding it but is mostly free from movement (although given that everything will be the same temperature, I don't see this being too much of an issue with false alarms etc.)
Providing I mount and sight the detector correctly (and with the Pyronix ensure the animal immunity is on), would this be an acceptable solution?
Alternatively, any other suggestions for this would be appreciated, aside from the high cost PIDS systems (e.g. microphonic wire).
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23 minutes ago, datadiffusion said:
Glad we could help. As a side note, it's good that you've put a 17Ah in but...
1. Some installers find they don't last anywhere near as long as a 7aH in terms of longevity
2. You really didn't need to for an all-wireless system with onely one RKP. To be honest even I wouldn't spec that on a domestic unless they were off-grid etc...
But hey ho, well done on not falling for the Yale tat. It's a decent system, and should last for years. When you can afford it I'd add a com-wifi for monitoring.
Ah right, in that case I'll keep a check on the voltage and general condition, I know the panel is supposed to do this itself, but I guess the occassional battery test won't do any harm too.
The only reason I went for the wireless system is to save me having to route the cables around the house (bone-idle but the thought of cable pulling through decades old insulation and ceiling voids haunts me!).
I originally looked at a few COTS systems like the Yale and Honeywell lines but they're a lot of money for not really that much. The Texecom system seemed really good value for money.
Already added the Com-Wifi, it was surprisingly easy to set up after reading a few horror stories on here, the biggest issue I had was getting the app working off my phone surprisingly. Very useful to have alongside the Wintex suite too.
15 minutes ago, sixwheeledbeast said:Just to clarify, the panel stands off from the wall with four plastic feet, in most situations cables would enter from the rear of the cab.
Agree with DD on the 17Ah's also
I've got the network cable to the RKP coming in through the back, I should have routed the power cable up and through the back but I wasn't aware of the stand off until I'd removed the knockout (6P's and all that, I know)...
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10 minutes ago, james.wilson said:
all wireless devices need a back tamper. This is to prevent them being removed during the unset period.
also what are you defining as a high level?
Understood, I'll add a screw into the devices I haven't yet done. I'm assuming this also negates the possible use of contact adhesive rather than screws on uPVC doors and metal sheet doors as well (something which was recommended to me but seemed dubious!)?
"High level" in this case is run along the top of an internal dividing wall (appr. 2.3m in height), visible but it's no matter since it's in a utility room.
2 minutes ago, datadiffusion said:Grading is effectively irrelevant if you're DIYing, except from the POV that I would want everything tampered so that means buying G2 as a minimum on components. Apart from door contacts you'd be hard pushed to find anything actually graded as '1' anyway, most tat is effectively ungraded. So yes, the back tamper is sacrificial and essential on wireless, stops the burglar moving the contact and magnet together without causing an alarm and then opening the door. As for the likelyhood of that, it's what a risk assessment is for.
Again, grading is irrelevent for DIY systems. If I were you I would NOT tell my insurer. Many people still think that by doing so you get a huge discount; you don't; but what you will get is a voided policy if you tell them you have an alarm but then they find out it wasn't set when you were burgled.
I wasn't really planning to claim it on my insurance for that reason, the grade 2 is a more of an understanding of how a company would have installed the alarm for assurance, for example, I have no alarm wiring on the attack side of the building, therefore I haven't included any provision for RKP cable protection, other than that the cable is run at a high level as to avoid damage from folks catching it when carrying the shopping in?
7 minutes ago, sixwheeledbeast said:Mechanical protection should be as per wiring regulations.
BTW I hate when the bottom knockouts are used on Premier cabs, causes hassle if you need to put larger batteries in there. The mains connection has it's own hole adjacent the mains connection.
Yeah I've found the 17Ah battery only just fits, but it fits okay. Unfortunately the only place I could put the panel means the knockout where the battery bay is was the only one I could use. I'm not planning to chuck hundreds of wired devices in there so a 17Ah should be fine from the calcs I've done.
Thanks for the replies, much appreciated!
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Hi all, a new user here but I have been reading the forum as a guest quite frequently.
Apologies if this should be in the DIY area, I wasn't sure where to post this.
I've recently completed the (DIY) installation of a Texecom Premier Elite system (all wireless aside from the RKP).
The system is working fine, no issues at all other than the normal teething problems (e.g. polling mode of sensors etc. which are all sorted) - the manual and literature are really a credit to the company.
Is there any chance anyone could advise on a few things:
1) The Impaq door contacts have a rear tamper plate which damages the device if it is removed from the wall/ door frame. I can't work out whether this is optional or required as part of the Grade 2 certification of the system as I can't see an intruder being able to defeat the door and then remove the door contact and magnet without triggering the alarm or tamper?
2) There are only two cables in the whole system, one is the 230VAC power supply that I've run from a fused spur near to the alarm control panel via a three core cable into the panel through a standard gland in the bottom of the panel, the second is the RKP cable (+12VDC,0V,Data+,Data-) that runs through the house into the RKP at a certain location. Do I need to mechanically protect either of these cables or is running clipped to a wall at high level okay, since damage (purposeful or accidental) to either will be notified via the control panel/ ComWIFI system?
3) Obviously, I have installed this system myself and although I do work within the electrical industry I hold no formal qualification from a security installation board. Does this effectively void the whole Grade 2 status of the system?
Problems with leaf tampers
in Members Lounge (Public)
Posted
Ah I've been looping the conductor around the screw and clamping the screw down on top of it, almost turning the conductor itself into a ring crimp if you get me? Good take away that about looping round then trimming, cheers.
I've give the cover a few taps/ pushes/ pulls and triggered/ reset the button itself a few times and it seems to be behaving, so maybe it was just a case of loose terminations and biting into the conductor a bit too much tightening the first time, it's only been the leaf tamper/ open screw terminal/ wraparound screw terminals I've had any issues with - I wish lever connectors were more commonly installed in everything!