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Pyronix Enforcer With Wireless Optex Perimeter Beams


EViS

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Having spent a fair amount of time researching a new alarm install, I have settled on the following setup to secure the exterior of the property as well as outbuilding.

 

- Pyronix Enforcer Control Panel V10
- ENF32UK-WE DIGI-WIFI Wireless Module x1
- KF4-WE Two Way Keyfobs x2
- XDL12TT-WE External Volumetric Detector x2 (one facing the vehicles and one facing the outbuilding entrance door)
- OPTEX SL-200TNR 60M Beam Detectors x2 (with Pyronix MC2-WE Wireless Contact x2)
- Hikvision Cameras x2

 

However, before ordering I have a couple of fairly fundamental questions which I still cannot find an answer to, hence turning to you knowledgeable lot ?

 

1. In order for the Optex beams to connect wirelessly with the Enforcer panel, am I correct in understanding that they will need to be fitted with the Pyronix MC2-WE wireless contacts? Or should I be installing the MC1MINI-WE wireless contacts? Or is there another wireless sensor which I should be purchasing (I have seen mention to the Inovonics EE1216 but unsure how this would communicate with the Pyronix)?

 

2. What is the difference between the Optex SL-200TNR and the AX-200TFR beams? I understand that they accept different batteries, but is there no other differences? Which is the superior product?

 

3. Other than an unswitched fused spur, is there anything else I need for the install (any alarm cable, etc)? Or anything which I have over-looked or you could further advise on?

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Spotted your initial post but I wouldn't personally use hardly any of the kit you posted about.

It also seems like a bit of an odd setup to be asking these questions. Sounds like some early warning system that may false alarm a lot, as above.

 

I can help with the Optex beam question a little, the SL version comes with an extra external housing and has more power options (i.e you could wire power).

Would say all the extra features would be unnecessary for domestic situation tho, they are both decent wireless beams with more than enough beam range for most domestic applications.

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1 hour ago, sixwheeledbeast said:

Spotted your initial post but I wouldn't personally use hardly any of the kit you posted about.

It also seems like a bit of an odd setup to be asking these questions. Sounds like some early warning system that may false alarm a lot, as above.

 

I can help with the Optex beam question a little, the SL version comes with an extra external housing and has more power options (i.e you could wire power).

Would say all the extra features would be unnecessary for domestic situation tho, they are both decent wireless beams with more than enough beam range for most domestic applications.

Perhaps if he is using a beam for notifications , better also on a timer? Or I guess height is the issue for sure 

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2 hours ago, al-yeti said:

No pirs? Window sensors, bell box? You think the external sensors will fa allot? Or you just using them as a notification?

The priority for the time being is to 'secure' the perimeter and outbuilding. I'd rather be notified that someone is lurking outside before they actually try to gain entry. However, in the future I may wish to expand the system to include internal PIR's, shock sensors, a bell box, etc., hence opting for the Enforcer panel now.

 

1 hour ago, sixwheeledbeast said:

Spotted your initial post but I wouldn't personally use hardly any of the kit you posted about.

It also seems like a bit of an odd setup to be asking these questions. Sounds like some early warning system that may false alarm a lot, as above.

 

I can help with the Optex beam question a little, the SL version comes with an extra external housing and has more power options (i.e you could wire power).

Would say all the extra features would be unnecessary for domestic situation tho, they are both decent wireless beams with more than enough beam range for most domestic applications.

Could you expand on what makes this an odd setup in terms of securing a boundary and external access points? The idea behind the beams is to limit the number of false alarms. Although I appreciate the PIR's won't be as effective.

 

Thank you for confirming the difference between the beams. If I do opt for these, I'll go with the SL version to allow hard-wiring in the future.

 

1 hour ago, PeterJames said:

I would use the CCTV as the perimeter security, set up properly it will only notify you if it sees humans 

I've done my best to research the pro's and con's between using CCTV vs beams and came to the conclusion that beams are less likely to FA and more likely to capture any human movement. I am assuming your experience is the opposite to this? I'm not interested in CCTV being used as evidence of any breaches/crimes (as we all know this is futile), but I am interested in using it to confirm any notifications (from broken beams or otherwise). However, if CCTV can indeed work as efficiently as beams and external PIR's, I'd much rather opt for these as a simpler (and potentially lower cost) setup.

 

49 minutes ago, james.wilson said:

I'd use the optex beans but not the pyronix stuff. You might want something more powerful/flexible than an enforcer it's a basic cheap panel

What would your suggestion be? Bearing in mind the access to tech/installation manuals for a non-alarm trade.

 

 

Edited by EViS
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Security is about layers start from the core and work out.

If the perimeter system fails to operate or false activates and cries wolf all the time your left with nothing for your investment (both time and money).

You can buy all the "best kit in the world" and apply it wrong you'll still have a poor system.

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22 minutes ago, sixwheeledbeast said:

Security is about layers start from the core and work out.

If the perimeter system fails to operate or false activates and cries wolf all the time your left with nothing for your investment (both time and money).

You can buy all the "best kit in the world" and apply it wrong you'll still have a poor system.

I'm using the "core" as being the exterior boundary to the property (i.e. the beams). If that primary system fails, the external PIR's facing towards the entrance doors should activate. If these secondary layers of security fail, the internal sensors/PIR's (to be installed at a later date) will provide the final level of defence. However, by the time anyone has gained entry, it's already mostly too late (IMO).

 

The CCTV being used instead of the beams/external pir's is a spanner in the works (as per my other thread). But it could be argued that if used in isolation, these are only providing one level of security as opposed to fitting in between level 2 (external pir's) and level 3 (internal pir's and window/doors sensors).

 

Although I may be missing what you're trying to get across with your reply ??

 

5 minutes ago, MrHappy said:

Anything outside is going to FA, if it doesn't FA its not going to detect anybody

I fully expect this. But would you therefore advise that it's a waste of time/money installing?

Edited by EViS
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1 hour ago, EViS said:

 

 

I've done my best to research the pro's and con's between using CCTV vs beams and came to the conclusion that beams are less likely to FA and more likely to capture any human movement. I am assuming your experience is the opposite to this? I'm not interested in CCTV being used as evidence of any breaches/crimes (as we all know this is futile), but I am interested in using it to confirm any notifications (from broken beams or otherwise). However, if CCTV can indeed work as efficiently as beams and external PIR's, I'd much rather opt for these as a simpler (and potentially lower cost) setup.

 

What would your suggestion be? Bearing in mind the access to tech/installation manuals for a non-alarm trade.

 

 

Both Dahua and Hik (Although I am less familiar with the latter) have really good AI with quite a low FA rate. The good thing is they send a picture to your phone and so you can visually confirm the activation rather than having to log into one app to find out which beam then into another to find look at the camera. They can be set up to detect humans or vehicles you can put a trip wire on the screen that is similar to a beam and determine the minimum and maximum size you want it to report.

 

My set up ignores my dog in the back garden (and foxes) but I know when my wife is bringing the washing in. If anyone approaches my back doors or out buildings I get notifications on my phone. I have the tripwires and intruder boxes set up so they only alert me after 18.00 and before 0630 weekends and 24hr weekdays (ive had to change that since lockdown though)  The recorder beeps if anyone approaches the front door 24/7. The only time I had false alarms was when my patio furniture cover blew half off the furniture, but to be fair I needed to know that happened so I didnt mind. I have turrets so spiders are not a problem either.

CCTV has really changed, it used to tell you what had happened it now tells you when something happens in realtime. 

 

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11 minutes ago, PeterJames said:

Both Dahua and Hik (Although I am less familiar with the latter) have really good AI with quite a low FA rate. The good thing is they send a picture to your phone and so you can visually confirm the activation rather than having to log into one app to find out which beam then into another to find look at the camera. They can be set up to detect humans or vehicles you can put a trip wire on the screen that is similar to a beam and determine the minimum and maximum size you want it to report.

 

My set up ignores my dog in the back garden (and foxes) but I know when my wife is bringing the washing in. If anyone approaches my back doors or out buildings I get notifications on my phone. I have the tripwires and intruder boxes set up so they only alert me after 18.00 and before 0630 weekends and 24hr weekdays (ive had to change that since lockdown though)  The recorder beeps if anyone approaches the front door 24/7. The only time I had false alarms was when my patio furniture cover blew half off the furniture, but to be fair I needed to know that happened so I didnt mind. I have turrets so spiders are not a problem either.

CCTV has really changed, it used to tell you what had happened it now tells you when something happens in realtime. 

 

Steady on ?.

 

So as a form of notification, would you say that CCTV should result in less FA's than external beams, even at night? How can I expand on the system of mobile push notifications to result in a loud alarm/chime being heard inside which has a chance of waking me up? Or could this be done in-app on the mobile (i.e. android)?

 

If CCTV is as reliable as you attest, in what scenarios are beams still used? Long open spans of farmland, wide open commercial spaces, etc.? Whereas in most residential situations, CCTV should be a superior option?

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Just set the notification on your phone loud enough to wake you up. Mine has never woke me up yet, but as far as I know nobody has been in my garden at least not approaching the entrances. AI is fairly new to be fair beams will continue to sell for a while but the technology is getting cheaper and cheaper I have face recognition numberplate recognition and allsorts on my NVR but thats only because I need to know how it works not because I use it. With the smart search I can search for someone wearing a yellow top, or a hat with vehicle search I can search a red or blue car its very clever and getting cleverer by the minute 

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4 minutes ago, PeterJames said:

Just set the notification on your phone loud enough to wake you up. Mine has never woke me up yet, but as far as I know nobody has been in my garden at least not approaching the entrances. AI is fairly new to be fair beams will continue to sell for a while but the technology is getting cheaper and cheaper I have face recognition numberplate recognition and allsorts on my NVR but thats only because I need to know how it works not because I use it. With the smart search I can search for someone wearing a yellow top, or a hat with vehicle search I can search a red or blue car its very clever and getting cleverer by the minute 

In your experience, have car lights and sudden changes in cloud cover been an issue with FA, as per @norman's reply above?

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45 minutes ago, EViS said:

Steady on ?.

 

So as a form of notification, would you say that CCTV should result in less FA's than external beams, even at night? How can I expand on the system of mobile push notifications to result in a loud alarm/chime being heard inside which has a chance of waking me up? Or could this be done in-app on the mobile (i.e. android)?

 

If CCTV is as reliable as you attest, in what scenarios are beams still used? Long open spans of farmland, wide open commercial spaces, etc.? Whereas in most residential situations, CCTV should be a superior option?

I say your using beams wrong way 

 

How you going to mount them where exactly?

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3 minutes ago, al-yeti said:

I say your using beams wrong way 

 

How you going to mount them where exactly?

Could you expand on how I would be using these in the wrong way? They would be mounted on opposing walls either side of the boundary.

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34 minutes ago, EViS said:

In your experience, have car lights and sudden changes in cloud cover been an issue with FA, as per @norman's reply above?

Tricky to say about clouds none of my set up is looking at open areas where the cameras would see clouds. My front camera would see headlights though especially when reflected off the back of my sons car, but not in the trip wire region.

I have a monitored system that reports to an Alarm Receiving Centre (ARC), when that was first installed it was going off all the time due tue the sun causing shadows on the ground as it went behind trees etc. But after about a week of logging in and adjusting the settings and a final walk test its been reasonably good. Most of the FA's have been cleaners coming in early or leaving later than agreed, tenants doing the same, the odd person using the building as a public convenience at night. and high winds blowing a large cardboard box into the rear. 

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Thanks Peter, that's been super helpful and has caused me to revisit the idea of CCTV which I previously discounted as still being inferior to a more traditional alarm with individual sensors.

 

You said earlier that "beams will continue to sell for a while" whilst CCTV becomes cheaper. But quality beams aren't exactly cheap and are fairly comparable in price to good quality cameras. So, as I touched on earlier, in what residential scenario would you install beams (or external tri-sginal PIR's), as I was proposing originally, over a quality 'smart' CCTV system as you have demonstrated?

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It is horses for courses I would always look at each site and make decisions based on the nature of the requirements. If the site is not suitable for AI CCTV detection then I would use beams. We have an large engineering site that has beams around the perimeter, it was installed a long time ago but all the cameras are looking from perimeter towards the site, so intruders would already be on site before they are detected if we used the cameras. we cant point the cameras along the perimeter because of high traffic (plus the expense of towers etc. The site has lots of copper and other valuable metal on site, the cameras are looking at the theft attractive property and the land between the perimeter but intruders would be detected by the beams quite a few minutes before any cameras would.  Most domestic situations, stables, tack rooms, gardens, garages, etc AI is perfect.  

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51 minutes ago, EViS said:

Could you expand on how I would be using these in the wrong way? They would be mounted on opposing walls either side of the boundary.

Against building or in garden walls?

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