tinnitus Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Hi guys, can you help settle an argument? Is it an nsi gold requirement that the engineer code be changed when an employee (engineer) leaves the company? Or is it just good practice? Also, should it be changed annually? thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Not that I know to, its good practice and sia does Quote securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinnitus Posted March 3, 2020 Author Share Posted March 3, 2020 8 minutes ago, james.wilson said: Not that I know to, its good practice and sia does Sh*t, I lost the argument then. To be fair, it’s a huge job for a medium to large company and probably impossible to complete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixwheeledbeast Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Good practice but not mandatory. Inspectors may suggest it but again not mandatory. Large companies just end up with lists of codes, as your unlikely to be able to swap every site. Some companies use either POTD or some random engineer code generator from a seed like the customer number, makes it harder remember them all. More importantly stops others having a handful of codes to all your sites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterJames Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 If you follow the fb forums there are plenty of shaved chimps asking for engineer codes for this co or that.It is good practice to change the codes I dont think the inspectorates care (even though they should) I have thought long and hard about using fobs as engineer codes all progged with the same number, It is a pain if a fob is lost its also a pain if an engineer leaves and doesnt give it back, but its a lot harder for anyone to get your engineer code Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Codes are a complete waste of time nowadays imo unless it's something like cotd. @PJ your mate was asking about defaulting a hkc on FB, I guessed one of yours? Quote Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted March 3, 2020 Share Posted March 3, 2020 Ideally it should be unique per site pod helps but is undone by clock resets etc Quote securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterJames Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 8 hours ago, norman said: Codes are a complete waste of time nowadays imo unless it's something like cotd. @PJ your mate was asking about defaulting a hkc on FB, I guessed one of yours? Nah he would struggle to nick any of mine, I dont have customers that about every penny I noticed though, I think its because he has realised Risco are crap Texecom have also let him down, he knows what I use and never heres me complaining. All the other shaved monkeys on FB have told him how good they are. I was tempted to say we've stopped using them since the incident with the helicopter crash but I dont think it would do me any good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al-yeti Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 1 hour ago, PeterJames said: Nah he would struggle to nick any of mine, I dont have customers that about every penny I noticed though, I think its because he has realised Risco are **** Texecom have also let him down, he knows what I use and never heres me complaining. All the other shaved monkeys on FB have told him how good they are. I was tempted to say we've stopped using them since the incident with the helicopter crash but I dont think it would do me any good You lock them yes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 Lol, all he does is ask questions on there, no issue with intruder but asking about fire makes me wonder. Tell him, like most things in Brighton they can be back doored quite easily... Quote Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterJames Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 10 hours ago, al-yeti said: You lock them yes? Im thinking I should Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al-yeti Posted March 4, 2020 Share Posted March 4, 2020 1 hour ago, PeterJames said: Im thinking I should Wow your joker , you install lots compared to me I lock every single one and tell everyone I do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinnitus Posted March 5, 2020 Author Share Posted March 5, 2020 On 03/03/2020 at 23:26, james.wilson said: Ideally it should be unique per site pod helps but is undone by clock resets etc James, this is the setup we have and I was actually wanting to change it to one code. I guess it’s way more secure overall but it’s a bit of a pain for call outs etc. Having said that we have an easy system to remember, same 4 digits then the first two numbers of the address. My issue was that when you changed all the codes it becomes almost unmanageable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixwheeledbeast Posted March 5, 2020 Share Posted March 5, 2020 If the seed to make the engineer code is that easy then I wouldn't say it's worth the effort. It's a little bit better to stop someone reading it off the panel to learn all your codes (possible but unlikely) but beyond that it's too easy to share the seed info which ideally shouldn't be known. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSE Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 (edited) Unique generator based on account number and contract number is what I use. We can have 20 mixed systems on a single site, all have different engineer codes. Far more secure this way, it’s rare but if and when a customer wants to leave for whatever reason, we issue the code on written request and if accounts are paid up as it’s no good on any other site Edited March 6, 2020 by PSE 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted March 6, 2020 Share Posted March 6, 2020 4 minutes ago, PSE said: Unique generator based on account number and contract number is what I use. We can have 20 mixed systems on a single site, all have different engineer codes. Far more secure this way, it’s rare but if and when a customer wants to leave for whatever reason, we issue the code on written request and if accounts are paid up as it’s no good on any other site Agreed your right Quote securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amps Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 8 hours ago, PSE said: Unique generator based on account number and contract number is what I use. We can have 20 mixed systems on a single site, all have different engineer codes. Far more secure this way, it’s rare but if and when a customer wants to leave for whatever reason, we issue the code on written request and if accounts are paid up as it’s no good on any other site So how would the engineer know each code? Some kind of app that he has to enter the account and contract number? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixwheeledbeast Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 That's the idea. The seed wouldn't be known and if the engineer left the company they wouldn't have access to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 Agreed. I have an app that does this, custom seed based on contract number. App needs authority to load etc so fully controlled. Also can only do 3 codes an hour Quote securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GalaxyGuy Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 Apps are fairly easy to overcome though, so you're relying on your employees at the end of the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al-yeti Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 4 minutes ago, GalaxyGuy said: Apps are fairly easy to overcome though, so you're relying on your employees at the end of the day. App access is just first layer Then you need seed So doubt employees bothered Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 Still more difficult than begging for a code on one of the Facebook groups, they usually take a few minutes to disclose them. Quote Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixwheeledbeast Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 You are relying on your employees but you wouldn't have taken them on in the first place if you didn't have some trust in them. Your going to struggle to stop people keeping there own lists but this is only the same as having individual passwords for every website login which is recommend. Having the "app" on your company website behind an engineer login portal is another option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al-yeti Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 6 minutes ago, sixwheeledbeast said: You are relying on your employees but you wouldn't have taken them on in the first place if you didn't have some trust in them. Your going to struggle to stop people keeping there own lists but this is only the same as having individual passwords for every website login which is recommend. Having the "app" on your company website behind an engineer login portal is another option. You think changing codes on annual inspection is ideal or makes it more complicated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted March 7, 2020 Share Posted March 7, 2020 Nah, bad idea imo Quote Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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