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Reddwarf4ever

Gardtec 840 removing smoke alarms from panel and program

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Thanks

 

i was previously planning to remove the smokes from the system myself and find a way t disconnect the cables.

 

looks like I will pay for some help, but managed to remove the first smoke detector using engineer mode, but now can’t work out how to make it active again ( unremove it)

 

can you help me with the steps in engineer mode to a ode to activate this smoke again p l e a s e

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In the pub...

 

14 hours ago, Reddwarf4ever said:

Hello

my alarm system and Smoke detectors are 25 years old, I have been told max life for smokes is 7 years, that’s why I am removing them, I plan to fit standalone fire angel dual detection smoke alarms, as recommended by the fire brigade.

 

currently deciding whether to replace a ‘ repaired’ control panel, two keypads & two wired bell boxes .....and keeping the existing hall sounder 8 PIR’s and 3 contacts...

 

because if I have the control panel replaced, the smokes will be removed in the process and save paying for the smokes to be removed now and later an Upgrade......

 

this is from my original install company ( who charge £200 / Hr )

 

The Main control panel we now use is a Pyronix Euro 46 8 zone control panel, For a Pyronix Euro 46 panel, keypad and battery you are looking at £300 fitted, extra keypads cost £80, Live bell boxes cost £120 Everything is plus VAT......so would be £620 plus VAT. = £744.....( looking at the wording, there may be extra labour to fit the extra keypad and bell boxes, starting to get expensive )

 

still waiting for the quote from the other alarm company who charge £85 / Hr....this company got me out of trouble once by repairing a blown PSU in my control panel.....wasn’t very expensive as I remember....and done some tidying of the programming......stopped part set making so many beeps before activating etc etc....so,I trust them.

 

Given the cost of the kit, there not a high about of money if your employing...


busy twisting coloured wires & hanging off ladders....

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, sixwheeledbeast said:

You would be lucky to get 4 years out of a Fire Angel and then they are for the bin.

 

I made an easy call out the other day, look after a block that has our system in the communal area plus heats inside each flat lobby.

 

Called out by block manager for 'your fire system false alarming' complaint from tenant which I was suspicious about as the site is on comms and no other complaints.

 

Landlord who had turned down our quote to replace in-situ Aico had put fire angels in every sodding room including the lobby next to ours.

 

Looks to me as if triggered by sunlight (massive full height uncurtained window). Landlord has removed that alarm, which isn't even needed, no more false alarms, block manager has passed invoice for false callout to landlord and paid in full.

 

(I should point out that the 'lobby' really is a tiny unfurnished lobby and the flats Aico is quite correctly in what should be considered the flats corridor)

 

49 minutes ago, MrHappy said:

Given the cost of the kit, there not a high about of money if your employing...

 

I don't understand why the gardtec is being replaced in that quote? I know Gardtec is ancient but 840 was top of the line, metal case etc... & so personally I would be happy to support it with a caveat it could conk out at any time with no spares availability.

 

I am not sure where the 7 years for smokes has come from, most smoke detectors as has been pointed out will have an expiry date printed on which is usually ten years.

 

As has been pointed out, there are no batteries to fail, a modern 12v optical detector in a domestic setting will easily reach this lifetime and maybe more provided it has regular smoke-simulation testing.

 

https://uk.eaton.com/content/gb/en/products/product-catalog/scantronic-Menvier-security-multifunctional-fire-detector-alarm.html

Edited by datadiffusion

So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands

 

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Posted (edited)
53 minutes ago, sixwheeledbeast said:

Only ever had Fike stuff FA from light levels

 

Yes, I had it from an ancient (15 year old) cheapo fluro lamp actually (on Fike).

 

But the way the sun reflected through this floor to ceiling uncurtained window at the same time of day as the FA, and the fact there clearly was no fire, I can't think what else it could be.

 

I have also been out to several 3-5 year old Fire Angels badged with local brigade logo where the 10 year battery has already failed.

 

The latest fad is brigade badged teabags ('test your alarm whilst the kettle boils') to be fair the tea is quite decent.

Edited by datadiffusion

So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands

 

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3 hours ago, sixwheeledbeast said:

Only ever had Fike stuff FA from light levels

Fike all sparkies fit yes?

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Posted (edited)

 

 

Thanks

 

i was previously planning to remove the smokes from the system myself and find a way t disconnect the cables.

 

looks like I will pay for some help, but managed to remove the first smoke detector using engineer mode, but now can’t work out how to make it active again ( unremove it)

 

can you help with the steps in engineer mode to a ode to activate this smoke again p l e a s e.....plus steps to remove contacts in engineer mode in case I need to remove PIR in the future......Risco said page 84 of the manual, but would be great if the steps to add a contact and remove a contact could be listed for me...

 

thanks

 

engineer mode Yes

prigram zones Yes

Enter zone number Tes

 

this is where I need the steps p l e a s e.....

 

incidently the gardtec 840 was installed 1987 and upgraded 2003 so the smokes are 16 years old

 

it is hanging on, both the keypads have lost their front flip covers, the rear bellbox plastic is very fragile...and the control panel has had the PSU  from the dialler jumped across , as the main control panel PSU blew....so its all working, just getting old.

Edited by Reddwarf4ever

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Posted (edited)

true dat

 

Not seen one in the wild for a few years now, but can always make out that Gardtec exit tone when I hear some shonky old shop shutting up for the night ;)  

 

3 hours ago, Reddwarf4ever said:

incidently the gardtec 840 was installed 1987

 

r u sure?

 

I am guessing you have, or have had, the oblong keypads then?

Edited by datadiffusion

So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands

 

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Posted (edited)

Yes that’s the keypads......

 

can anyone one help me with the engineer sequence to remove and add zones ? P l e a s e

 

have the manual, but the YES NO options get a bit confusing, I am capable, I am to programming, but just need a little help.

 

thanks in advance...

 

PS the displays are crystal clear.....and I am certain as I can be it was installed in 1987 as it was installed as the house was being built, which was in 1987......why does the year sound strange ???

7CC9C33D-AC31-4D50-8055-3A536304B7BE.jpeg

Edited by Reddwarf4ever
Added a picture

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10 hours ago, Reddwarf4ever said:

Yes that’s the keypads......

 

can anyone one help me with the engineer sequence to remove and add zones ? P l e a s e

 

have the manual, but the YES NO options get a bit confusing, I am capable, I am to programming, but just need a little help.

 

thanks in advance...

 

PS the displays are crystal clear.....and I am certain as I can be it was installed in 1987 as it was installed as the house was being built, which was in 1987......why does the year sound strange ???

7CC9C33D-AC31-4D50-8055-3A536304B7BE.jpeg

im sure this is the contour 6 wire keypad

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Not if it's got ACE I thought?


So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands

 

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If it is the contaur 6 keypad, what year do you guess at ?

 

i had an upgrade in 2003, don’t remember the keypads being changed, but who knows.....my memory doesn’t LOL

 

if it had ACE would I then have a Fob ? Which I don’t have.....

 

found the engineer contact remove procedure.......

 

Enter engineer code
Press yes
Prog zone yes
Prog zone type yes
Enter zone number which is to be turned off
Press no
Yes
Yes
Press no until it says off
Press
Yes
Press 0/esc until you come out of engineer mode.

Just need a way to identify the smoke connections in the control panel, I know the zone numbers, but don’t know if the zones are numbered in the control panel, or maybe there are special connections just for smokes.....now I can remove the zones in the program, just need to remove the cabling at the control panel

 

any help please ?

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1 hour ago, Reddwarf4ever said:

If it is the contaur 6 keypad, what year do you guess at ?

 

i had an upgrade in 2003, don’t remember the keypads being changed, but who knows.....my memory doesn’t LOL

 

if it had ACE would I then have a Fob ? Which I don’t have.....

 

found the engineer contact remove procedure.......

 

Enter engineer code
Press yes
Prog zone yes
Prog zone type yes
Enter zone number which is to be turned off
Press no
Yes
Yes
Press no until it says off
Press
Yes
Press 0/esc until you come out of engineer mode.

Just need a way to identify the smoke connections in the control panel, I know the zone numbers, but don’t know if the zones are numbered in the control panel, or maybe there are special connections just for smokes.....now I can remove the zones in the program, just need to remove the cabling at the control panel

 

any help please ?

What happened to paying someone to do this?

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6 hours ago, Reddwarf4ever said:

if it had ACE would I then have a Fob ? Which I don’t have.....

 

Not a fob in the modern sense, it was Ir based and obsolete now, unique to gardtec.


So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands

 

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On 09/07/2019 at 16:20, al-yeti said:

What happened to paying someone to do this?

Come on al: You don't believe in Witches, Wizards and Goblins so why would you have believed that ?.


Customers Love us, Intruders Hate us.

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Hello

removing teh smoke alarms in the program didn’t work well.....the wiring removal at the panel involves resistors , so,out of my comfort zone.

 

so I have put my hands up and waiting two estimates, may go for justbthis or an upgrade depending on the quote .

 

i do a lot of DIY myself, but this has defeated me.....thanks for all the help and advice..

 

cheers

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Well waited over a week for the estimates and one finally materialised .......comes in at over £1000

 

this is to install a new control panel two keypads and two bell boxes......all wiring in place and re-using existing 8 PIRs and 3 contacts.

 

this is too expensive for me......been told it’s for an Eaton, Scantronic ION system

 

had a quick look and it seems this is a bit OTT for me, especially as trying to do on a budget. 40 Zones ???

 

i know I have 11 at the moment, but can reduce PIRs to get Down to 5 PIRs and 3 contacts, so an 8 Zone would be suitable. I know I have been told before I can’t chose the alarm system I want, as the installer will have a preference, but the Installer isn’t paying for it I am.....I would not like it if a car salesman could insist on what car I buy, or isn’t this a fair analogy ?

 

so taking aside the installers preference, what’s my best choice to replace the Gardtec 840 wired system, replacing only the control panel 2 keypads and 2 bell boxes ?

 

I would like to be able to configure / tweak the program, at some future time if I needed to. But don’t really need colour LCD etc.....Do I ?

 

need some help please.......I could still go for just paying to remove the smokes, approx £100 I am told, but the alarm exit keypad occasionally displays “system in use”  unless I wait 5 seconds after entering the exit code and pressing Exit now.....hasn’t happened once seen I adopted this method, BUT the control panel has a frigged PSU as the original failed......so all is not happy currently.........need to make a decision.....

Edited by Reddwarf4ever
  • Upvote 1

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Hope you were sitting down when you read that. If your looking to downsize the system, maybe you could look at something like a Pyronix euro mini. That would give you 10 zones using Double end of line wiring. I've installed several of these & so far found them to be a good reliable panel, that doesn't break the bank.

Unfortunately your a bit too far away for me to offer to come and fit one for you.

Edited by Specialist

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2 hours ago, Reddwarf4ever said:

Well waited over a week for the estimates and one finally materialised .......comes in at over £1000

 

this is to install a new control panel two keypads and two bell boxes......all wiring in place and re-using existing 8 PIRs and 3 contacts.

 

this is too expensive for me......been told it’s for an Eaton, Scantronic ION system

 

had a quick look and it seems this is a bit OTT for me, especially as trying to do on a budget. 40 Zones ???

 

i know I have 11 at the moment, but can reduce PIRs to get Down to 5 PIRs and 3 contacts, so an 8 Zone would be suitable. I know I have been told before I can’t chose the alarm system I want, as the installer will have a preference, but the Installer isn’t paying for it I am.....I would not like it if a car salesman could insist on what car I buy, or isn’t this a fair analogy ?

 

so taking aside the installers preference, what’s my best choice to replace the Gardtec 840 wired system, replacing only the control panel 2 keypads and 2 bell boxes ?

 

I would like to be able to configure / tweak the program, at some future time if I needed to. But don’t really need colour LCD etc.....Do I ?

 

need some help please.......I could still go for just paying to remove the smokes, approx £100 I am told, but the alarm exit keypad occasionally displays “system in use”  unless I wait 5 seconds after entering the exit code and pressing Exit now.....hasn’t happened once seen I adopted this method, BUT the control panel has a frigged PSU as the original failed......so all is not happy currently.........need to make a decision.....

Buy whatever you want , a house basher might charge you £450 to swap over whatever you want with no warranty or call backs..... Unless you pay callouts of course

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7 hours ago, Reddwarf4ever said:

had a quick look and it seems this is a bit OTT for me, especially as trying to do on a budget. 40 Zones ???

 

I assume you mean it is a '40 zone panel'? This doesn't mean you need to use all the zones...

 

It's actually only a ten zone panel (wired) plus 30 zone (wireless) out of the box, and in fact it's an 80 zone maximum panel anyway - they just carried over the '40' model number from the previous version, which was 16 on board and 24 wireless ;)

 

Assuming it is a 40H that is. If it is you'll be getting free, app based monitoring for life so I'd say fair quote based on the number of zones, for Essex.

 

(If you did want to go down to 8 zones, if it was me quoting I personally would still be quoting the 10 zone 40H by the way, as it is still the most suitable panel (that I sell).)

Edited by datadiffusion
Completely forgot about the wireless bits!

So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands

 

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6 hours ago, Specialist said:

Hope you were sitting down when you read that. If your looking to downsize the system, maybe you could look at something like a Pyronix euro mini. That would give you 10 zones using Double end of line wiring. I've installed several of these & so far found them to be a good reliable panel, that doesn't break the bank.

Unfortunately your a bit too far away for me to offer to come and fit one for you.

Isn't the Pyronix euro mini@ wireless system ..? Need a wired system .......

 

assuming the Pyronix euro mini is a wired system, what should I expect to pay to fit the panel 2 keypads and 2 bellboxes to an existing wired system using existing PIRs and contacts thanks 

Edited by Reddwarf4ever

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