freshr Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Hi, I have been reading some of the excellent advice on the forum and have decided to try and DIY install a wired Texecom Premier Elite 24 panel in my ground floor flat. (It will be bells only, as there are always other neighbours in the building.) There is an obvious place to site the panel in a cupboard my hallway. However, I have read about "smash and grab" attacks that can disable the panel before the entry timer has finished. So I have two questions: 1) If someone kicked in the door and reached the panel before the entry timer finished, could they prevent the siren from triggering? Or would pulling it from the wall or destroying the panel somehow trigger a failsafe in the external sounder (which will be wired)? 2) Would it be a possible to put a PIR in the cupboard with the panel, that will trigger an immediate alarm if someone enters the cupboard even during the entry countdown? (I would put the keypad in the hall for this setup.) Thanks for any advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 The attacks you mention are more common in smaller spaces (where the panel is obvious or easily found) or planned jobs, and to be honest they are the reason a professional would (or should) always at least offer monitoring, of a type whereby the connection itself is constantly checked - 'monitored monitoring' if you like. However, you are right that a correctly installed bell will have it's own battery to protect against such an attack. But, will it be external or next to the panel, i.e in the hallway? Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freshr Posted January 30, 2015 Author Share Posted January 30, 2015 I can see that such an attack could prevent the panel from alerting a monitoring company. But from what you say, an attempt to destroy or disconnect the control panel should trigger a correctly installed bell (which I am mounting externally). That's great, as it will simplify my setup, and mean that I can put a cheaper keypad in the cupboard with the panel (rather than a designer one that is to be "on display"). My flat is not huge, and I am just trying to protect against petty thieves, as I doubt anyone more serious would find much to justify their efforts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 The downside to the keypad in the cupboard is; You will not be able to protect the panel during entry/exit (if it's in the same cupboard) It will highlight to an intruder where the panel is Also, just talking from a professional POV, the contents of a premises are part of a risk assessment, but not everything. I'd personally only ever install to a minimum standard if a flat had £2 or £20000 worth of valuables. Having an outside bell is definitely a good move though if you are relying on bells only, as it will greatly reduce the opportunity to destroy both the panel and bell simultaneously. Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freshr Posted January 30, 2015 Author Share Posted January 30, 2015 You mean an intruder will be alerted to its location by the keypad beeping during the entry countdown? I hadn't considered that. Based on what you have advised, I think I will have the following approach... - Keypad in hallway - Panel in cupboard - Cupboard door protected by magnetic contacts (which I hope can trigger an immediate alarm condition, even during entry?) Many thanks for the advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Just destroy the bell first. Quote securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freshr Posted January 30, 2015 Author Share Posted January 30, 2015 Ha ha! Very true. I'll have an internal sounder which should therefore trigger, and be loud enough to alert the other households in the building. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Ok. Set of ur internal see how many come to ur aid? Quote securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freshr Posted January 30, 2015 Author Share Posted January 30, 2015 I guess you are saying any bells only setup is weak security? If so, I concede your point. But I just want my alarm to do two things .. 1) deter thieves and 2) make a noise if someone tries to break in. There are other households in the building who I trust to investigate or call me if they hear the alarm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al-yeti Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Ok don't destroy bell Fill it foam first Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 (edited) I think as long as you are aware of the huge limitations of a bells-only system, that's fine. However, if I had penny for everytime I heard 'I'm sure the neighbours will look out for us' but also for every time they 'didn't hear a thing' after the event... Edited January 30, 2015 by datadiffusion Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goncall Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Im an alarm man and im bells only its better than nothing,tho get a dog better than any alarm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al-yeti Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Feed most dogs they quiet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goncall Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Feed most dogs they quiet Not this one it is nuts even the window cleaner refuses to come anymore as it throws itself at the windows,the derg not the window cleaner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Yeah I wouldn't want a window cleaner that throws themselves at the windows, must be bad for business. Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breff Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Fit the keypad outside of the cupboard and put a contact on the cupboard door Quote The opinions I express are mine and are usually correct! (Except when I'm wrong)(which I'm not) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Agreed. Sounds like that is what he is going to do. I would add to include a bolt on the door esp. if it is a thin 'wardrobe' type effort. Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freshr Posted January 30, 2015 Author Share Posted January 30, 2015 Great, I'll take that advice. Thanks all. I just want to give the local "opportunists" some difficulty. If Ocean's 11 comes along, I'm stuffed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rulland Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 At the end of the day it's a deterent, anyone who wants in, will get in, hit and run, they'll grab what they can quickly, this is more likely to be a problem in a property that is secluded from others, gives them more time, best we can do is hope they'll go somewhere else that hasn't got a sounder/bellbox outside, even with a 'monitored' system there is still that 'timeslot' unfortunately, and the tossers know that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixwheeledbeast Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 That type of attack may effect a poorly designed wireless system. With a wired system the removing the Hold Off will trigger the bell on an attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rulland Posted January 30, 2015 Share Posted January 30, 2015 Brilliant if the neighbours, if any, respond, my argument exactly swb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixwheeledbeast Posted January 31, 2015 Share Posted January 31, 2015 The OP said there are neighbours. Obviously a bell only system is just that, bells only. Comms would offer more security but it depends on the risk/budget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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