Sparks-UK Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) Hello all. I am an electrician and new to security alarm installations. Might be a long post so don't get annoyed please. I have an ion40 alarm, all the sensors, door contacts and sirens have been hardwired using the normal 4 pair alarm cable. Link to engineers manual removed... Norm The panel is a 16 zone panel, I have 8 pir sensors, 4 door contacts, 1 outdoor siren, 1 indoor siren and a keypad. The control panel also has a speach dialler module which just clips on to it. So all the cabling has been done and I've started to connect them but don't know if I'm doing it correct or not. What I have done so far: For all the pir sensors and door contacts, I've bunched all the 12v + and -, and have them connected to the aux 12v + and -. For all the pir sensor, I've connected the alarm (wires) together, two zones spread over 2 zones (3 terminals) using a common. I have also connected all the tamper (for pir sensors only) and joined them in the 16th zone (3 terminals, using a common). And thats about it....don't know what to do with the rest, I have a bunch of resistors (that came in the box) but don't know if they are needed or not. As stated before, I'm and electrician, a very capable one but limited to mains wiring. I've fitted many fire alarms, really big units too so thought this would be similar to those but obviously I was SOO wrong. Any help will be much appreciated.. Kind regards and good day to you all. Edited July 17, 2014 by norman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 So all the cabling has been done and I've started to connect them but don't know if I'm doing it correct or not. What I have done so far: For all the pir sensors and door contacts, I've bunched all the 12v + and -, and have them connected to the aux 12v + and -. For all the pir sensor, I've connected the alarm (wires) together, two zones spread over 2 zones (3 terminals) using a common. I have also connected all the tamper (for pir sensors only) and joined them in the 16th zone (3 terminals, using a common). And thats about it....don't know what to do with the rest, I have a bunch of resistors (that came in the box) but don't know if they are needed or not. As stated before, I'm and electrician, a very capable one but limited to mains wiring. I've fitted many fire alarms, really big units too so thought this would be similar to those but obviously I was SOO wrong. Any help will be much appreciated.. Kind regards and good day to you all. OK, this is more a generic alarms issue than anything do with the Ion. First things first, what make of PIRs and door contacts are you using? Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew.brough Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Special ones if they need 12v feed Quote www.securitywarehouse.co.uk/catalog/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks-UK Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 Hi, Yes, just to clarify, there is no problem with the alarm (so far), I just don't know how to install it. All the contents of the alarm, the control panel, pir's, door contacts, sirens etc came together in one package. The pir and door contacts are made by 'optex'. The outdoor siren is a 'premier elite odyssey 3 & 3m' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 What's the current draw of the pirs and current supply of the panel? Quote Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks-UK Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 Hi, The control panel has 12v written on it for the power outputs, the pir's also have 12vdc + - written on the terminals so I'm assuming it 12 volts all over? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Hi, yes it will be 12v, but what is the current rating / draw? Quote Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 The pir and door contacts are made by 'optex'. Are you sure? I didn't think they made door contacts. Not being picky, we do need to know. Either way they (ideally) need to be the types with EOL resistors built in, but suspect they aren't if its a kit. Special ones if they need 12v feed Like he said! What's the current draw of the pirs and current supply of the panel? I think there is about 600mA going spare on this panel so guessing 6 PIRs will be OK. But a fair and relevant question for the OP to confirm. However, sounds like there are two bells and the built in speaker driver takes a hefty wack, 150mA I measured I think. If used. Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al-yeti Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 So you normally don't need 12v power going to any door contact The reistors go in the pirs and the door contacts a specific way, manual should show you this I don't know this panel, does it have a global tamper aswell? Dr fusion ? Two sirens? As said above perhaps a speaker aswell but if it's one of those small piezo sounders they don't draw that much Back to the doc! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morph Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 If you all the bits you got came as a package, then should you not be asking the supplier for support in the first instance,after all you paid them for the kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) In theory yes he should, but something tells me it's not so much a package as a handful of grade 1 door contacts and optex savers chucked into a box... I don't know this panel, does it have a global tamper aswell? Not as such, all 16 on board zones (its a handy panel, with on board ethernet and very reliable serial webway support too) are fully programmable EOL. But you can program any number as a 'global tamper' or simply a tamper (but cannot assign them as a 'tamper to' other zones as such) As I said to someone the other day, it says a lot that Cooper / Eatons latest product is a fully CC 10 zone expander. EOL obviously a bit much then. Hmmm, I'm saying all this, maybe it does have an 8 zone CC mode. Never looked, never needed to. Def. all EOL out the box. Edited July 17, 2014 by datadiffusion Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks-UK Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 Hi, I've registered with the tech support guys 'cooper security' and they seem to be quite rubbish in terms of support, explained the situation to them and they guy on the other end seemed quite clueless. The pir's and door contacts are definitely made by 'OPTEX'. I have the instructions infront of me. The 'current draw' on the pir's is '8mA (normal), 11mA (max) at 12VDC. The pir's have 8 terminals (4 pairs), 2 for 12 VDC + -, 2 SP (spare), 2 NC Alarm and 2 NC Tamper. It doesn't say anything about any resistors The PIR's are 'OPTEX SAVER' thats the exact model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks-UK Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 The door contacts are by 'CQR SC570/WH/MULTI/G2 or G3', my bad, sorry. They have 3 terminals in them, 2 for 12v + - and one spare, it also says to cut one of the links to make it a tamper so I've done that on all of them...not sure if I should have done that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) OP, I cant see any optex contacts on the EU website See hee for how EOL resistors work... http://www.gargoylesecurity.com/DownloadableFILES/End%20Of%20Line%20Resistor.pdf Its not perfect and the lack of pictures is lame but its a start You do NOT need 12V to the door contacts! The CQR SC570 are OK. I've got them in my home (and only at home, I don't fit them as a rule) You will not need to fit resistors to these. Just cut two wires. The manuals should explain. For scantronic, the shunt is 4.7K and the loop is 2.2K Edited July 17, 2014 by datadiffusion Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixwheeledbeast Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 The door contacts are by 'CQR SC570/WH/MULTI/G2 or G3', my bad, sorry. They have 3 terminals in them, 2 for 12v + - and one spare, it also says to cut one of the links to make it a tamper so I've done that on all of them...not sure if I should have done that. Hmm, you seem a bit out of your depth here... Some quick pointers... Door contacts don't have power. CQR Multi has links that you cut for different values. I assume Scantronic are still using 4K7 alarm, 2K2 tamper. The Optex Savers are good PIR's, although they do not have EOL resistors built in; so you will need the resistors supplied. Please refer to the manual on how to install the resistors in the sensors. When you say 4 pair I assume you mean 8 core alarm cable? You need to find out the total system current, I know Optex Saver's are 11mA max so that's a start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks-UK Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 Hi Guys, Regarding door contacts, I don't have the instruction manual with me nor am I on site, I remember three terminals with one spare and cutting one link on the contact...I shouldn't have said it was for power, just assumed, wrongly ofcourse. I've read the link sent by datadifussion on EOL resistors and I understand I should put them in, I have the instruction manual that has come with the Optex saver but there are no instructions on fitting resistors... and to clarify, I have connected the cable to the two terminals on the door contacts, have cut a link too but have not connected on the control panel side... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datadiffusion Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Afraid as per swb this is a fairly complex panel, programming it will need a lot of thought... If you can I'd take a battery, the panel, keypad, and ethernet cable and a laptop to a quiet corner of somewhere and have a play. Avoid the cooper UDL it will only cause more confusion, it is not laid out in a particularly user friendly pattern. You'll have far more joy with the built in webserver. But you'll need to set this up which has a little manual of its own available from cooper. Quote So, I've decided to take my work back underground.... to stop it falling into the wrong hands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparks-UK Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 Hi Guys, Thanks for all the replies and info (especially datadifussion), I think I'm going to call in a professional to finish the job. I underestimated the amount of technical know how needed for the job and right now I just need the job done so any recommendations for the South West London area..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixwheeledbeast Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 http://www.thesecurityinstaller.co.uk/community/forum/268-uk-security-installers-by-regional-police-force/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al-yeti Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 http://www.thesecurityinstaller.co.uk/community/forum/268-uk-security-installers-by-regional-police-force/ Beat me to it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cubit Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Hi, I've registered with the tech support guys 'cooper security' and they seem to be quite rubbish in terms of support, explained the situation to them and they guy on the other end seemed quite clueless. Really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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