Aljrob Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 Hi all, this place seems to be a mine of information! I was hoping that someone might be able to give me the benefit of their experience, as I'm currently in the process of buying my first house. There is an alarm fitted, but I don't really like the look of it - i.e. it's ancient, and I've got no confidence whatsoever that the thing will work! As such, I'm interested in a new professionally fitted alarm system. The house is a turn-of-the-century two-bed terrace, of about 850sq ft total. There are currently only front and back doors, and we may look to install a french window to the garden in the future. The garden is pretty inaccessible though, as it backs directly onto a (sunken) railway branch line before the line disappears into a tunnel. My (zero experience) thoughts so far on our needs are as follows, but please feel free to point out anything I may have missed: * "Bells Only" system, but with a module that would text two or more numbers if alarm goes off (I work only 15min from the new house). Would be good if the controller was one of the new ones that uses secure key fobs rather than / in addition to codes. * 1 Front Door magnetic(?) sensor * 1 Back Door magnetic(?) sensor * Cabling for future installation of a sensor on French Window to rear - should I buy the sensor in anticipation? * 1 Front downstairs window vibration(?) sensor * 3 (or perhaps 4) Pet Friendly PIRs (Hall, Reception Room, Landing) - we don't have pets but would like a cat in near future NB- I would of course check with my insurance company (not yet settled upon) before going with a bells-only system My questions for you pro's are: 1) Does this seem appropriate? If any changes are recommended, what should they be? 2) Obviously I'm budgeting pretty carefully for buying a first home - any indications of how much this sort of thing (including any recommendations) would cost would really be appreciated (note: I live in London - South East, but fairly central) 3) Is there a monthly service charge for the text-message-sending-thingies? 4) Does anyone know of an NSI (Gold?) approved company who operates in SE London who could supply & install? Many thanks in advance for any help & advice you are able to offer. Aljrob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rjbsec Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 My advice would not to be relying on figures and advice in this way - any professional installer should be willing to visit (for free) to survey your home and provide a risk assessment, specification and quotation; there is no substitute for seeing the property and its location etc. There are a number of installers here who work in and around London, some of whom are SSAIB or NSI approved. My advice would be to get 2 or 3 installers to come around and provide the above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aljrob Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 My advice would not to be relying on figures and advice in this way - any professional installer should be willing to visit (for free) to survey your home and provide a risk assessment, specification and quotation; there is no substitute for seeing the property and its location etc.There are a number of installers here who work in and around London, some of whom are SSAIB or NSI approved. My advice would be to get 2 or 3 installers to come around and provide the above. rjbsec, Thanks for your comments - I would of course get (no-obligation!) quotes in once the property is mine, however at this stage I'm some way off completion but trying to plan my finances - which being a first-time buyer are quite tight! - obviously though and alarm is pretty high priority, so I'm just trying to get an idea of whether my thoughts on what we'd need are correct, and what the Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aljrob Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 Hi AlrobIm guessing but expect at least Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 All pretty much covered as mentioned above get some quotes in, without seeing your property it seems tidy enough. One thing not mentioned is the costs of a text dialler, you can get pay as you go but make sure you know the service limitations on usage as some will shut down after 6 months of inactivity. The cost will then be per text, which cam be as low as 4p a text dependant on service provider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 One thing not mentioned is the costs of a text dialler, you can get pay as you go but make sure you know the service limitations on usage as some will shut down after 6 months of inactivity. The cost will then be per text, which cam be as low as 4p a text dependant on service provider. I think the reason it wasn't mentioned is that he will have a BT line on site so it will be just for sending texts over the PSTN network, not over GSM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 Pete,Thanks for the ballpark guesstimate, it's very helpful! I'll bear you in mind when we come to actually do this. Rgrds, Aljrob Any other thoughts anyone? hi Aljrob, if you think you will want Police response you will need to get an NSI or SSAIB registered company or one (like me) who can pass you over to one after installation. one problem of delaying the ARC (Alarm Receiving Centre) connection is the regulations keep getting tampered with, so if you delay say by a year or more, your panel may well be to out of date for acceptance for Police Response, make sure you cover this aspect with whoever you go with. you have to be made aware ARC connected systems will require a reset proceedure if it activates, some can do this by remote, but an opertor error can still be costly - so ask the prices. your eventual insurrance co may not even ask you to fit a system so it becomes a 'peace of mind' purchase, you will encure with most companies an anual maintenance costs (but not with mine as i work differently) which covers you for one anual visit on a siren only system, and the right to call there service dept 24 hours a day for a fault, but beware additional calls are usually charged in addition. expect If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aljrob Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 I think the reason it wasn't mentioned is that he will have a BT line on site so it will be just for sending texts over the PSTN network, not over GSM. Exactly - though perhaps I was being presumptious in assuming the texts could be sent via a BT line! Glad to hear they can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aljrob Posted February 12, 2007 Author Share Posted February 12, 2007 hi Aljrob,if you think you will want Police response you will need to get an NSI or SSAIB registered company or one (like me) who can pass you over to one after installation. one problem of delaying the ARC (Alarm Receiving Centre) connection is the regulations keep getting tampered with, so if you delay say by a year or more, your panel may well be to out of date for acceptance for Police Response, make sure you cover this aspect with whoever you go with. you have to be made aware ARC connected systems will require a reset proceedure if it activates, some can do this by remote, but an opertor error can still be costly - so ask the prices. your eventual insurrance co may not even ask you to fit a system so it becomes a 'peace of mind' purchase, you will encure with most companies an anual maintenance costs (but not with mine as i work differently) which covers you for one anual visit on a siren only system, and the right to call there service dept 24 hours a day for a fault, but beware additional calls are usually charged in addition. expect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted February 12, 2007 Share Posted February 12, 2007 lol..... Aljrob, there is more to nsi and ssaib than police response, but go for your life securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 lol..... Aljrob, there is more to nsi and ssaib than police response, but go for your life and yes ther is James, but how long did you want my post to be? i just covered some of the more hidden points, the guy don't want to be an installer - yet regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 we have outstanding issue's - place me on your ignor list as you rcently proved no point in me having any discussion with you. what i have said is factual - read it again i will not discuss openly the finer details of this guys system within a public forum in order to offer a guestimate price, i would not trust with all respects to the op, a client's untrained oppinion on what he/she thinks he/she needs? that would be some risk assesment imo i deal in security and client confedentiality, as i just happen to work in the security industy and i take giving my advice because of it very seriously. If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.wilson Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 enough now lads, keep it civil (looks at arf) securitywarehouse Security Supplies from Security Warehouse Trade Members please contact us for your TSI vetted trade discount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 enough now lads, keep it civil (looks at arf) some just don't respect that word 'civil' let alone respect.. reg's alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rjbsec Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 you will encure with most companies an anual maintenance costs (but not with mine as i work differently) which covers you for one anual visit on a siren only system, and the right to call there service dept 24 hours a day for a fault, You don't recommend maintenance? You don't do maintenance? You don't do callout? You work for free? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arfur mo Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 You don't recommend maintenance?oh, another arfurburner stike me thinks -:and where did i ever say or intimate that Roger? answer me this, is it an approved registered guys thing, to read something and totally misread or not understand it? - oops! sorry you must be good at all this as you have to read all those regs i don't bother with (as if), incedentally, did you find that regs bit on tampers yet, mind you i thought you had to know the regs off by heart, my mistake again?i digress-:yes i do recommend maintenance is done regularly, but i don't stick my clients arm up their back to stay with me by using a contract. You don't do maintenance?yes i do - see above - like my doctor checks me out regularly, but by request not compulsion. You don't do callout?yes i do, 24 hour availability for no standing charge as it's not needed very often - thiss an experience + quality of instal + equipment thing (and i'm also very healthy and thank you for asking). You work for free? i see your mis reading me again, please pay attention - i charge for the installation (like the prescription), but if this o/p was to recommend and i got 10 aalarms from his leads or has a large factory and he wants a new phone system along with structured cabling and CCTv, he may well get his home and/or office alarm for absolutely free. so whats your problem with that please tell me i'm all ears, as imo it is no diferent to offering a discount for the total contract quantity or as a thankyou. or do you turn 35% trade discount for quantity down at your wholesalers on moral grounds? well i think not but again please let us all know for sure won't you?. looks like i'm really 'the doctor' then if you really want to throw rocks at me, best you not use regulation 'grains of sand' imo. regs alan If you think education is difficult, try being stupid!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aljrob Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 Woo, things seem to have drifted a little off-topic Moving swiftly along, thanks all for your advice thus far - any further input welcome... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 Please keep this thread on topic and not dig up the same old arguments that are best discussed elsewhere, unless the topic opener states an interest(!). At the end of the day if Aljrob wants to have an insurance approved alarm he will have to use an SSAIB/NSI company. If he doesn't need it approved then he can go anywhere. TBH, why someone would not use an approved company is beyond me, but clearly lots do. Edit: Aljrob posted while I was compiling mine Zak Tankel - Managing Director - Security First (UK) - www.securityfirst.uk.com Disclaimer: Any comments or opinions expressed by me are my own as a member of the public and not of my employer or Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aljrob Posted February 13, 2007 Author Share Posted February 13, 2007 At the end of the day if Aljrob wants to have an insurance approved alarm he will have to use an SSAIB/NSI company. If he doesn't need it approved then he can go anywhere. TBH, why someone would not use an approved company is beyond me, but clearly lots do. Hi Zak, I was wondering whether there are SSAIB/NSI companies who will fit bells-only systems (i've come accross a fair number on Google who only do monitor systems - is commission paid to installers by the monitoring co's I wonder )? Whilst I can of course see the benefit of a police response system, this is our first house and my partner and I simply don't have the spare finances at the moment to commit to paying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 Hi Zak,I was wondering whether there are SSAIB/NSI companies who will fit bells-only systems (i've come accross a fair number on Google who only do monitor systems - is commission paid to installers by the monitoring co's I wonder )? Whilst I can of course see the benefit of a police response system, this is our first house and my partner and I simply don't have the spare finances at the moment to commit to paying Zak Tankel - Managing Director - Security First (UK) - www.securityfirst.uk.com Disclaimer: Any comments or opinions expressed by me are my own as a member of the public and not of my employer or Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 13, 2007 Share Posted February 13, 2007 At the end of the day if Aljrob wants to have an insurance approved alarm he will have to use an SSAIB/NSI company. Not quite correct, I have a few systems on contract that are approved by the insurance companies and I'm not a member of any inspectorate. Depends on the insurance co as to whether they will accept this though. You do have to have an alarm maintained, but not neccesarily installed by, an approved company if you want police response. Although it does make sense to use an approved company who are happy to do a bells only system for now and then upgrade to a monitored system later if that is the intention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DAVE IN KENT Posted February 15, 2007 Share Posted February 15, 2007 hi just to add the company i work for installs in south london and we are a nacoss gold company. system would be around the 800 mark i would think but our survayor would happily come out and give a no obligation quote. call BESURE SECURITY we are in the yellow pages. NSI GOLD BASED IN KENT INTRUDER,ACCESS CONTROL,CCTV,FIRE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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