The Arab Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Best one(worst) was at 1st service customer only had 3 zones and internal sounder (siren) next to panel cable 1 leaves panel goes down to front door surface (plasterboard walls) cable 2 goes down corner then onto skirting away to pick up phoneline cable 3 down wall beside cable 2 but onto top of dado rail to rear of house cable 4 leaves panel goes down wall along with cables 2 and 3 and along underside of dado rail at end of dado cables 3 and 4 cross each other.Quality !! Another one was panel in cupboard under stairs with keypad mounted below panel cable out to CO detecter above cupboard door then into internal sounder (siren),Cable 2 out of panel picks up pir in front room then across top of facing picking up pir in kitchen (final) then picks up phoneline.very neat but you can walk in front door and to alarm without touching any protection. Hope this gives you some idea of what happens when numbers matter more than quality. The Arab Trade Member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 :yinyang: Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Arab Posted July 13, 2005 Author Share Posted July 13, 2005 Remembered another one turned up 1st service visit again thought keypad looked differant but had the correct name on it so in with engineer code any problems missus no she says not since i got them back to fix it,so put panel into walk test nothing except front door working so away to panel opens lid all the wires lying in the bottom opens pir no wires opens viper no wires opens front door contacy again no wires.So looks closer all protection is wireless so out to the car gets manager on the phone "we don't support wireless systems"he says try and find out what you can without letting customer know that alarms not working. Turns out system was installed by deale while hubby was away on rigs and he's a sparky he comes home and hit the roof and got installer back who promptly fitted a wireless system to get them off his back but because house had foil backed plasterboard nothing except front door contact which was next to the keypad with the receiver in it worked. I was going to go back to wire pirs etc but customer moved and vowed to only use a company that installs and services. Must admit had me going for half an hour or so. Trade Member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistle Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 No comment seen it all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morph Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 I was going to go back to wire pirs etc but customer moved and vowed to only use a company that installs and services.Must admit had me going for half an hour or so. *D* not doing this any more then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Service Engineer Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Prior to them starting these dealerships, they had a much better status in this industry, I must admit to wondering why these dealerships are still going on, and why there's still systems being installed so poorly. I really do not envy the service engineers attending these jobs for the 1st time, it must be soo disheartening. But what exactly do they do when they discover a shoddy installation.. ? Does the attending engineer put it right..? or does it get passed back to the installing dealership for correction..? ........................................................ Dave Partridge (Romec Service Engineer) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Arab Posted July 13, 2005 Author Share Posted July 13, 2005 Was left to servicing company engineer as if it was over 3 months old it was out of dealers warranty period. If you find anything wrong you put it right as last man in clears all before Trade Member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Service Engineer Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 If you find anything wrong you put it right as last man in clears all before But does he, I've seen plenty during take-overs that have been sub-standard for a couple of years.Why don't ALL these dealership installs get visited within a few weeks of install, and the company concerned called back to correct any issues prior to being paid.? ........................................................ Dave Partridge (Romec Service Engineer) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 But does he, I've seen plenty during take-overs that have been sub-standard for a couple of years.Why don't ALL these dealership installs get visited within a few weeks of install, and the company concerned called back to correct any issues prior to being paid.? 60718[/snapback] Because weren't they installing around 2500 systems a month nationwide? It all comes down to cost. They allowed anyone to be a dealer. One in our area, who was one of their biggest, did not know ANYTHING about alarms at all. It was a sales driven exercise to make money. The fact that it was alarms being sold was secondary. A lot of people made a lot of money very quickly until the company pulled over 90% of their dealerships overnight. Apart from tacky or sub-standard installs, the initial kit sold would never generate a confirmed alarm. It's not like they didn't know there were going to be problems. Another company near us were looking for engineers to install 3 systems a day (per single engineer). Madness Zak Tankel - Managing Director - Security First (UK) - www.securityfirst.uk.com Disclaimer: Any comments or opinions expressed by me are my own as a member of the public and not of my employer or Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest IM_Alarms Posted July 13, 2005 Share Posted July 13, 2005 Think we all know why they don't............... just juggle the words , 'eye' and 'blind' !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Arab Posted July 13, 2005 Author Share Posted July 13, 2005 Think it was because the dealership was run nationally from down south so if there were no call outs as soon as it was put in,it was another contract number on a list as far as i could make out.If you asked for a full list of contracts in your area you were classed as a pest because the admin dept had far more pressing thing to organise or do. So because all letters for domestic customers were generated on a computer the first you knew about a new dealer job in your area was service time probably 8 months after instal. Trade Member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bri Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 My advice would be to advise the customer to write to the main dealer with a strong letter of complaint and copied to NACOSS and SSAIB. The question arises 1) should you put it right ANSWER) NO! Your time is money, and unless the customer is willing to pay you the cost of remedy and restoration so be it. Remember:EVERYTIME YOU GET YOUR SCREWDRIVER OUT OF YOUR BOX AND OPEN A PANEL ETC TO RECTIFY A FAULT ITS CHARGEABLE!! Please no smarmy comments about screwdriver, you all know what I mean. Dont let the big boys keep pulling the rug from under us. We have to let the public know that big is not neceserrily cheap and most efficient option. The only way their going to do that is vote with their feet and not buy from them. Bri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Service Engineer Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Because weren't they installing around 2500 systems a month nationwide? It all comes down to cost.No Excuse mate, that isn't even 1 per district per day. Surely a local Service Engineer could be notified of each install and asked to just pop by within 2 weeks to see if all is ok, and that the customer is happy.Also as pointed out in a Trade Discussion, QUOTE: from Smart1,Who employs the subbie? Who vets them? Who draws up the specs/contracts? Who supplies the kit? Who trains the subbies on the equipment to be installed? Who manages the subbie? who commissions the job? Who Checks the works? NSI ........................................................ Dave Partridge (Romec Service Engineer) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb-eye Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 No Excuse mate, that isn't even 1 per district per day. Surely a local Service Engineer could be notified of each install and asked to just pop by within 2 weeks to see if all is ok, and that the customer is happy.Also as pointed out in a Trade Discussion, QUOTE: QUOTE: from Smart1,Who employs the subbie? Who vets them? Who draws up the specs/contracts? Who supplies the kit? Who trains the subbies on the equipment to be installed? Who manages the subbie? who commissions the job? Who Checks the works? NSI Customers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 No Excuse mate, that isn't even 1 per district per day. Surely a local Service Engineer could be notified of each install and asked to just pop by within 2 weeks to see if all is ok, and that the customer is happy.Also as pointed out in a Trade Discussion, It would seem that certain procedures are NOT being met, on a regular basis. 60741[/snapback] Sorry, I wasn't trying to justify why they did it - just making a point as to probably the reason why nothing was checked (large company - no conscience). Zak Tankel - Managing Director - Security First (UK) - www.securityfirst.uk.com Disclaimer: Any comments or opinions expressed by me are my own as a member of the public and not of my employer or Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 It would seem that certain procedures are NOT being met, on a regular basis. 60741[/snapback] This i have to admit was a topic discussed long and hard at NACOSS meetings where ALL NACOSS installers objected to the //.National Installer.// practice of dealerships and it apears we were correct in saying that what //.National Installer.// have done is ruining the reputation of NACOSS installers who are not involved. Even my own web master became a dealer behind my back BridgewoodJef 60744[/snapback] Wasn't ICON formed by NACOSS specifically for the dealerships? Zak Tankel - Managing Director - Security First (UK) - www.securityfirst.uk.com Disclaimer: Any comments or opinions expressed by me are my own as a member of the public and not of my employer or Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 This is old news. Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jb-eye Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Wasn't ICON formed by NACOSS specifically for the dealerships? Not sure Zak. I thought ICON were formed because NACOSS thought they were going to loose their grip on the industry with APCO dropping the boll1cks they did deregulating things and loosing the Police approved list.Jef Customers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 This is old news. 60764[/snapback] it was a question not a broadcast Zak Tankel - Managing Director - Security First (UK) - www.securityfirst.uk.com Disclaimer: Any comments or opinions expressed by me are my own as a member of the public and not of my employer or Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 it was a question not a broadcast 60774[/snapback] It was aimed at the post in general. Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Sorry then! Zak Tankel - Managing Director - Security First (UK) - www.securityfirst.uk.com Disclaimer: Any comments or opinions expressed by me are my own as a member of the public and not of my employer or Company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 Accepted. Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitro Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 But does he, I've seen plenty during take-overs that have been sub-standard for a couple of years.Why don't ALL these dealership installs get visited within a few weeks of install, and the company concerned called back to correct any issues prior to being paid.? i know it an old post chaps . i believe //.National Installer.// should have a dedicated engineer to check the system witin a few weeks of installation. . we service engineer at //.National Installer.// could do without this visit cos we have enough on our plate .At present the customer will not normally see an engineer until they book an engineer for their next RI visit 6 mths time.i have on number of occassion report to our dealership dept for non-compliance of system or installation . i must admit they was bad at the start of the dealership program but they are today a far better standard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 i know it an old post chaps . i believe //.National Installer.// should have a dedicated engineer to check the system witin a few weeks of installation. . we service engineer at //.National Installer.// could do without this visit cos we have enough on our plate .At present the customer will not normally see an engineer until they book an engineer for their next RI visit 6 mths time.i have on number of occassion report to our dealership dept for non-compliance of system or installation . i must admit they was bad at the start of the dealership program but they are today a far better standard Dont think they are....looked at one this weekend for a friend of a friend....everything was okay untill you went to set it.......he said my exit terminator does'nt work...not surprised really as when i presented the key fob too the button, the button came right out of frame....although it was missing something...a bit of cable to connect it to the panel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reidmail Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I went to do a first service on a domestic alarm in Sutton Coldfield fitted by a dealership. I noticed the keypad in the cupboard downstairs, OK so far. Then I asked the customer where the panel was, he told me that he wasn't in when it was fitted and would have to call his wife, this he did but unfortunatley she didn't know either. I asked her where the installers were working most when it was fitted, she thought about it for a while and then said, "Well they did spend a long time in the BATHROOM" I went in the bathroon and there was nothing in there out of the ordinary, until I took the side off their BATH and there it was, right under the taps not even fixed to the wall, along with the spur, which also was "free range" The even odder thing was that the cupboard with the keypad inside was directly below the bathroom, so the lot could have gone there anyway (Which eventually it did) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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