Is This Live?

[oasistechnical]

i find this thread rather funny!

 

as a qualified electrician, and a suitable qualified and registred intruder and fire alarm engineer

i, like most of us, have come accross disturbing cables and connection points on a weekly basis!

 

i ahve just come back from a CCTV install (finish off job, sign off etc) the builders mate is making

off connections in a three phase mains board to feed a dishwasher!!

 

the board is still live and he has no test equipoemnt, all he has is a stanley screwdriver and a pair

of combimnation plyers, no earth sleeving.

 

also i found out that he fitted the three spurs i needed and the double unswitched socket outlets!

 

so, just to make sure before final connection of kit, i removed the accessories and had a look, all were

wired wrong phase/neutral earth cut off!!!!

 

so we approached the owner, he reply was,  `it works dont it!`, yep we re wired and re connected the supply

the reason why, i want the cheque from the building owner!!!

 

yep i find em everywere!!!  (not that difficult really!)

 

some sarks i have worked with a bloody good, but alop do not understand the regs

 

Oasis

[Mattodare]

I'm sure this is covered by a question in the current CSCS test lol

[arfur mo]

Another method I agree, but even so neons and voltsticks should be banned.

Two pole and proving in an ideal world or a DVM.

you can never be too cautious when testing fir live mains, either of the above options your relying on test leads having good continuity, but after a period of time there is high risk of them breaking within the sleeving, especially in the highly flexed portion of the leads.

intermittent leads could give false results ending up with a risk of severe shock for the user (even after having used a testing block).

personally my first test is using Fluke Volt Light 4L, this has. very bright LED but alsi a handy clip when yiu need ti free a hand. if no indication (because it has an off/on switch and batteries), i use a Fluke 15B DVM, still no indication i then check using 2 different neon drivers.

even after all that, i never grab a 'known dead' lead, but always perform a test with a swipe using the back of my finger so i can't grip if it is live.

[norman]

Doesn't mean you will get it though...

[Oxo]

you can never be too cautious when testing fir live mains, either of the above options your relying on test leads having good continuity, but after a period of time there is high risk of them breaking within the sleeving, especially in the highly flexed portion of the leads.

intermittent leads could give false results ending up with a risk of severe shock for the user (even after having used a testing block).

personally my first test is using Fluke Volt Light 4L, this has. very bright LED but alsi a handy clip when yiu need ti free a hand. if no indication (because it has an off/on switch and batteries), i use a Fluke 15B DVM, still no indication i then check using 2 different neon drivers.

even after all that, i never grab a 'known dead' lead, but always perform a test with a swipe using the back of my finger so i can't grip if it is live.

 

Would rather a DVM than a stick that lights up if rubbed.

 

As for neons, ffs give it a rest.

[Cubit]

So, lets not use a meter because the leads might be faulty?

Hmm

 

Volt stick and neon to be the order of the day.

 

To avoid any doubt, the word to use here is dangerous.

[Oxo]

Funny enough whenever I use a DVM I check the resistance of the leads  before "using" it.

 

One reason is I sometimes forget to put leads back after a MA reading.

 

So no way do I get caught out.

[Cubit]

Funny enough whenever I use a DVM I check the resistance of the leads  before "using" it.

 

One reason is I sometimes forget to put leads back after a MA reading.

 

So no way do I get caught out.

And checking with a proving unit is not a bad idea either.

Thing is, it is recommended to check an electrical appliance before each use, to not check a meter and leads is folly.

[PSE]

I was just about to say, I test the curcuit before doing anything, Get the lockout kit out of the van and lock it off for safety.

 

Before working on it, test with my martindale voltage tester, If its dead, Use my proving unit to verify. Its the best and only way in my opinion

[arfur mo]

So, lets not use a meter because the leads might be faulty?

Hmm

Volt stick and neon to be the order of the day.

To avoid any doubt, the word to use here is dangerous.

ah, so now we get ti your basis for repeated insult and repeated slander?

where did i ever say not to use a meter? i perform and advise 4 tests at least one with a meter, how on Gods green earth can that ever be dangerous?

if you trust any flexible copper leads, even on a 2 point tester as having permanent continuity, you are not just badly trained, highly dangerous but mad as a hatter.

as stated, they do break within the plastic/rubber sleeving, not just wear and tear, but get caught in car doors, or yanked by tripping or whilst tangled. i have even seen 'engineers' twirling test kit by there leads.

most often they break where the cable enters the probe plug, but also within the probe itself from the constant bending and twisting in se. with the retractable insulated probes the plug can intermittently fail to make contact with the socket, especially split male pin versions.

Test Leads can show continuity when touched together using ohms (traditional standard meter test), but disconnect when you apply to test volts. Meter range selection and the switches themselves are also a source of dangerous mis reads.

use a volt stick - battery operated, do i honestly need to say more?

btw, anyone trained using damp or wet test equipment of any kind, thats not just been out if their sight, but brought to them by an untrained (let alone trained person), working on mains in a pit, as was claimed in the neon screwdriver discussion thread (so come on, really anyone, REALLY?), should be locked up for their own bloody stupidity - and societies safety in general.

or was that you in that pit?

Funny enough whenever I use a DVM I check the resistance of the leads before "using" it.

One reason is I sometimes forget to put leads back after a MA reading.

So no way do I get caught out.

that will save your meter from harm, but not you.

And checking with a proving unit is not a bad idea either.

Thing is, it is recommended to check an electrical appliance before each use, to not check a meter and leads is folly.

so how would you test for intermittent test leads?